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General E46 Forum
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Old 02-18-2017, 10:33 AM   #1
r2
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Join Date: Jun 2016
Location: upstate ny
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My Ride: 2002 330cic
lambda errors on 1 and 5

i put my 330 Cic up for storage in nov. never had a service eng light on before. i been starting it every 2 weeks and letting it run for 30 min each time. yesterday, i started it for its 30 min run and it was idling very rough until it went into closed loop. as soon as it did, the service eng light popped on. i shut it off waited 10 min for it to cool and the ecm to reset, restarted, and the light was still on, now in open loop too. ideas?
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Old 02-18-2017, 12:13 PM   #2
jfoj
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Location: Fairfax, VA USA
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Not sure why you are saying the engine/DME is in Open Loop?? Just because the SES/CEL/MIL is on does not mean the engine/DME is in Open Loop.

Also not sure what you mean about waiting 10 minutes for the DME/ECM to "reset" is about. The DME/ECM does not reset by turning the key off.

Anyway, you need an OBDII tool to read the codes and Freeze Frame data.


If you have a smart phone or table, get an OBDII App and interface so you can read the codes along with Live/Realtime or Freeze Frame data then you will know exactly what is going on with the engine fuel management system.

The OBDFusion App and proper VeePeak interface from Amazon are less than $30 for both.

OBDFusion for Android is is $3.99.

https://www.amazon.com/Veepeak-Bluet...peak+bluetooth

OBDFusion, for the iProducts it is $9.99.

For iProducts you NEED a Wifi adapter or LE Bluetooth adapter which are more expensive and VeePeak does not offer these yet..

iProducts requires Wifi - https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00WPW6BAE...ywords=veepeak

Not worth guessing, but you will have Misfire with Fuel Cut Off would be my "guess" and the problem will most likely due to a vacuum leak. CCV lower oil return line would be on my radar.
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Solve your misfires, lean codes, rough idle - http://forum.e46fanatics.com/showthread.php?t=897616

Fuel pump failures - http://forum.e46fanatics.com/showthread.php?t=929501

Temp Info - http://forum.e46fanatics.com/showthread.php?t=964491

Hidden OBC Menu - Check Voltage, Temp, Fuel Level - http://forum.e46fanatics.com/showthread.php?t=239619

E46/E39 GM5 Door Lock Info - www.bmwgm5.com

Lower hose temp switch O-ring - BMW #13621743299
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Old 02-19-2017, 07:45 AM   #3
r2
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My Ride: 2002 330cic
during closed or open loops, different sensors are used and different values are allowed.
think of open loop as "choke" mode.
from the manual:

Open/Closed Loop Operation

Open Loop

When the engine is first started the system goes into open loop operation. In open loop, the DME calculates the Air/Fuel ratio based on inputs from the coolant and MAF sensors. The system remains in open-loop until the following three conditions are met:

Coolant temperature above 105F.
Oxygen sensor has varying output voltage (indicating it is hot enough to operate properly).
A specific amount of time (preprogrammed into the MEM-CAL) has elapsed.
Closed Loop

When all of the above conditions are met, the system goes into closed loop operation. In this mode, the DME calculates the Air/Fuel ratio based, mainly, on input from the oxygen sensor and maintains the Air/Fuel ratio at the desired 14.7 to 1.

and i did read it with INPA. that's how i know it is lambda errors on #'s 1 and 5
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Old 02-19-2017, 09:36 AM   #4
jfoj
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Quote:
Originally Posted by r2 View Post
during closed or open loops, different sensors are used and different values are allowed.
think of open loop as "choke" mode.
from the manual:

Open/Closed Loop Operation

Open Loop

When the engine is first started the system goes into open loop operation. In open loop, the DME calculates the Air/Fuel ratio based on inputs from the coolant and MAF sensors. The system remains in open-loop until the following three conditions are met:

Coolant temperature above 105F.
Oxygen sensor has varying output voltage (indicating it is hot enough to operate properly).
A specific amount of time (preprogrammed into the MEM-CAL) has elapsed.
Closed Loop

When all of the above conditions are met, the system goes into closed loop operation. In this mode, the DME calculates the Air/Fuel ratio based, mainly, on input from the oxygen sensor and maintains the Air/Fuel ratio at the desired 14.7 to 1.

and i did read it with INPA. that's how i know it is lambda errors on #'s 1 and 5
While I appreciate the attempt at an education, I think you need to FORGET about the Loop Status, it has absolutely nothing to do with your problem. Additionally my point is you can have the SES/CEL/MIL lit and the engine can be and will continue to be in "Closed" Loop feedback fuel control.

Also with regard to the information you posted about Open/Closed Loop status, not sure where you found this information, but it clearly is very generic, out of date and has little to do with the BMW E46 or most other BMW's with OBDII systems. Just from the MEM-CAL statement this is likely some older GM generic info you are posting?

Engine temperate has very little to do with the Loop status, OBDI and pre-OBD, yes, since OBDII has been on the street for the last 20 years things are very different. The E46 will be in Closed Loop in 90 seconds or less with engine temperature of 50F or less. I have LOADS of Logs and supporting information to back this up and I have been dealing with Driveability problems for a very long time so I have a very unique understanding of how this all relates.

I also think you are mixing Lambda errors with Misfire With Fuel Cut Off for possibly cylinder #1 & #5 unless you meant to have the title of this thread Lambda Error on Bank #1 & Bank #2.

My first guess is you will ultimately find the Lambda errors are due to a Lean condition caused by 1 or more vacuum leaks. You will not likely need to replace anyone on the engine that has a wire connected to it. But once you properly diagnose the issue we will then see if my guess is correct.

Highly suggest you put INPA away for this exercise and get the OBDFusion App and interface as I mentioned above.

Read this at least 3 times: Solve your misfires, lean codes, rough idle - http://forum.e46fanatics.com/showthread.php?t=897616

And Smoke Test the intake and crankcase as this will save you hours of guessing and replacing parts.





http://forum.e46fanatics.com/showthread.php?t=1115860

Cheap fluid transfer pump from your local auto parts store or Amazon.

http://www.amazon.com/ABN-Multi-Use-...fer+pump&psc=1

A few rubber gloves, rubber bands and some cheap mini cigars from our local gas station or convenience store. You can also use a cheap E-cigarette and it may be safer than a lit cigar as well. Not sure if you can use mineral oil in the E-cigarette or if this would be to flammable.

Also get a good, bright LED flashlight to locate the escaping smoke. Look deep in the engine compartment and under the engine if needed. Do not forget the dipstick guide tube and the lower CCV oil return line. These areas may be hard to see from above in the engine compartment.

After looking for intake air leaks, remove the oil fill cap and allow the crankcase to fully fill up with smoke, then replace the oil fill cap. Check for cracks in the valve covers and leaks around the grommets, half moons and around the perimeter of the valve cover.

Common areas of leaks:

Upper and lower intake boots
Upper intake boot around F connector
DISA main O-ring and shaft area
Vacuum hoses under the rear of the intake
Fuel pressure vent hose that connects to the F connector on the upper intake boot and under the drivers floor board where it connects to the fuel pressure regulator
CCV and hoses, especially the lower oil return line
Dipstick and dipstick guide tube
Oil fill cap
Valve cover gaskets and cracked valve covers
SAP vacuum line to Kombi valve on front of engine, this will not leak smoke because of the control valve under the rear of the intake
Power brake booster sucking jet pump and hoses.
__________________
Solve your misfires, lean codes, rough idle - http://forum.e46fanatics.com/showthread.php?t=897616

Fuel pump failures - http://forum.e46fanatics.com/showthread.php?t=929501

Temp Info - http://forum.e46fanatics.com/showthread.php?t=964491

Hidden OBC Menu - Check Voltage, Temp, Fuel Level - http://forum.e46fanatics.com/showthread.php?t=239619

E46/E39 GM5 Door Lock Info - www.bmwgm5.com

Lower hose temp switch O-ring - BMW #13621743299
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