Save yourself up to $200 and some headaches - Electric Fuel Pump PM

Wow, what a prices! Couldn't image VDO-Siemens making bad stuff indeed.

Originally Posted by jfoj

The E9x fuel pumps are so bad I think NHTSA is looking into a possible recall if there numbers meet mass quantity!

Originally Posted by E46Mango

Just the 135/335/535 high pressure fuel pump. Not the regular 325/328/330 as far as I know. And even then the fuel pumps were updated for the later models with a superceded part#

yep the larger N55 turbo engined cars. FI needs more fuel and that high pressure fuel pump can't take it.

Originally Posted by jfoj

Yea, I have not stayed on top of the specifics of the E9x, but there has been a lot of noise about fuel pump problems on some of the models.

with respect..then why post something you don't know specifics about. it appears you posted this to promote your agenda on bad bmw fuel pumps. correct me if i'm mistaken.

Alex323Ci I did not post this to promote any sort of agenda other than to point out to there are many other BMW models with worse pump problems than the E46. So this is a correction as I believe you are mistaken about my purpose. My purpose is to make E46 owners aware that for slightly over $100 they can choose to proactively replace their fuel pump before it leaves them stranded and may possibly cost them far more in the long run. So have commented they can get free towing, some are BMW CCA members and get parts discounts, this is all great, but not everyone gambles on $100.

Many members were touting how well their 12 year old pumps are working and how they do not want to replace their pumps proactively. To each his own, I just find that there is nothing that aggravates me worse or plays havoc on my schedule when I have a car leave me stranded. Luckily I can only recall 1 time many years ago when an ignition module went out in a Chevy, but it was before kids, less than 1 mile from my house in a parking lot and I was able to replace the module where the car left me hanging without too much disruption to my schedule.

I have also stated that possibly the pre-2000 pumps may be lasting longer?? Seems that the majority of the recent failures have been post 200 cars. Again this is a general observation and I do not have hard facts to back up this statement.

I have read a few things on the E9x series cars, but again, since I do not own one or know anyone who does own one, I have not really researched and gathered more data on them. Heck I have not even bothered to memorize the E9x series models as they changed the naming convention for the individual body types.

I know both The Alex (yes that's now your name) LOL and JFOJ both are great members with great contributions. $165 or so for the pump, filter, and relay and an hour of your time can prevent some real headaches which is guaranteed to happen given the age of these pumps along w/ all this heat we're having.

JFOJ, I think you should edit your title to say save at LEAST $500... not save up to $200. The bare minimum you'd save from doing this pump on YOUR schedule w/ internet prices and $5 in hand tools is $500. I'd say the average is around $700-$1,000.

We should setup a paypal account and accept donations.

Originally Posted by jfoj

Alex323Ci I did not post this to promote any sort of agenda other than to point out to there are many other BMW models with worse pump problems than the E46.

sounds legitimate to me.
thanks for clarifying and not taking offense.

Mine died at the 11 year mark, around 150k miles. I was lucky enough to have it die in my driveway. I was unlucky enough to have it die with a full tank of fuel, and about -5F outside, which meant due to the full tank, I got to do the job outside in the freezing cold. Ended up taking me ~1.5 hours since I had to run inside and warm up every 5-10 minutes.

Seriously people, if you are at that 130k+ mile area, just replace it. It's dirt cheap insurance that you won't have your day screwed up by a dead pump. You also get to ship it ground instead of overnight it when it fails which saves a bit too.

Originally Posted by jneumann

Mine died at the 11 year mark, around 150k miles. I was lucky enough to have it die in my driveway. I was unlucky enough to have it die with a full tank of fuel, and about -5F outside, which meant due to the full tank, I got to do the job outside in the freezing cold. Ended up taking me ~1.5 hours since I had to run inside and warm up every 5-10 minutes.

Seriously people, if you are at that 130k+ mile area, just replace it. It's dirt cheap insurance that you won't have your day screwed up by a dead pump. You also get to ship it ground instead of overnight it when it fails which saves a bit too.

+25mp.

good stuff.

I just hope the P0171/P0174 codes my Z4 is throwing and the sometimes delayed start (takes 1-2 seconds to fire some days while my E46 has -always- fired within a half a second or less, right up to the fuel pump failure) isn't the fuel pump. The Z4 pump is at least 2x more expensive, and I'm getting this feeling I'd have to pull the entire top to access the damn thing.

Originally Posted by jfoj

Another pump failure situation on a 2004! - http://forum.e46fanatics.com/showthread.php?t=931335

After 7 years I would be getting nervous!

Yep that is me , I was think of doing the pump soon , but died yesterday and the total cost 500 bucks from my Indy, almost thought of towing it to dealer but realized I can get taken up 100 miles and dropped at my INdy.

jneumann,

You could have pump issues, but have you also looked over the first link below in my signature?

Assume the Z cars may have similar issues, but as this is an E46 forum, I haven't paid much mind about the Z cars. Also the Z cars are a bit misleading based upon the year, as a Z3 is based off an E36?? where a Z4 is based off and E46 or something like that.

I remember looking at a 2000 Z3 and it was clearly not like an E46.

Also if the pump is different, it may be a different vendor or overall different design? Guess you would need to find some of the other forums that have Z car members to see what the pump lifespan may be?

One way to kind of eliminate the pump as a possibility other than pressure and volume test is to prime the fuel system by turning the key on and off 2-3 times before starting to see if the engine fires off easier, if not, then I would look at vacuum leaks and maybe a squirrely cam sensor?

Originally Posted by jfoj

jneumann,

You could have pump issues, but have you also looked over the first link below in my signature?

Assume the Z cars may have similar issues, but as this is an E46 forum, I haven't paid much mind about the Z cars. Also the Z cars are a bit misleading based upon the year, as a Z3 is based off an E36?? where a Z4 is based off and E46 or something like that.

I remember looking at a 2000 Z3 and it was clearly not like an E46.

Also if the pump is different, it may be a different vendor or overall different design? Guess you would need to find some of the other forums that have Z car members to see what the pump lifespan may be?

One way to kind of eliminate the pump as a possibility other than pressure and volume test is to prime the fuel system by turning the key on and off 2-3 times before starting to see if the engine fires off easier, if not, then I would look at vacuum leaks and maybe a squirrely cam sensor?

The Z4 is a completely redesigned platform, very similar to the E46 mechanically and electrically. The Z3 was based off the E30 and E36, with the 2000+ cars being partially based off the E46 (engine, electrical, etc)

I haven't dove into the full problem yet, I'm betting squirrely cam/crank sensor given what I've heard the symptoms are for those sensors going bad. As for the codes, I've yet to dive into that yet either, but CCV is at the top of my list as I already replaced a dry rotted intake boot and two bad coils that were causing loads of problems. I'm mostly just waiting until the car will be sleeping in my dad's shop all winter to work on it. The SES light oddly enough only pops on when the car is driven slow, I.E. commuting conditions. If I reset it and drive it hard, it won't come back, which leads me to believe it is vacuum related. I have a fuel pressure tester so I'll check that this winter too. I've got a list probably $1k+ long for this winter that includes the cooling system (it's a 2003 at 65k miles and already has pulley noise on startup), CCV, cam/crank sensors, and top motor.

I don't see many issues with a failed fuel pump in the Z4's, but the biggest problem with them is not many people have much more than 100k miles on the oldest ones.


Oh, and I'd like to mention, "BMW" fuel pumps alone are not crappy. Almost all fuel pumps start to have high failure rates once you get around the 150k mile mark. That's when the fuel pump died on one of my previous cars too, though it was nice enough to do so in the middle of an intersection.

If it has the M54 motor and is anything like ours, i'm farily certain those codes are due to a cracked vacuum line on either the SAP or F-connector at the intake boot. Also check the vacuum line at the fuel pressure regulator. If im not mistaken, those codes are lean bank 1 and 2 which indicates a system-wide lean condition. The long starting could be fuel volume and/or pressure. you know the drill :p

Originally Posted by FenderGuy05

No joke, I swapped the horn and fuel pump the day it went out just to rule that out...what a PITA!

Can you share some experience how you did that? I was stuck by the wiring harness. The pump relay is visible, but the horn is definately unaccessible. I think I need to remove the 3 black harness plugs from the white housing. But they are damn tight. There would be some sort of locking tabs but I just can't find them. How do you guys do it?

Just ordered mine from BMA for $106. You guys got me scared shitless, but it'll be good for some peace of mind. How hard is it to put the sending unit onto the new pump?

I believe the $106 part is the sending unit/pump combo. Even if it not, it should be fairly easy to swap just the pump anyway.

On my E39 M5, the pump is close to $300 and you do not get the sending unit, it was just 2 wires, 1 hose clamp and 3 wire ties.

The hardest part of the pump change is the sending unit seal, DO NOT INSTALL THE SEAL ON THE SENDING UNIT FOR RE-INSTALLATION, PUT THE SEAL GROOVE ON THE FUEL TANK OPENING LIP! This is the main issue that catches most people as usually the seal come off stuck to the sending unit.

Originally Posted by jfoj

I believe the $106 part is the sending unit/pump combo. Even if it not, it should be fairly easy to swap just the pump anyway.

On my E39 M5, the pump is close to $300 and you do not get the sending unit, it was just 2 wires, 1 hose clamp and 3 wire ties.

The hardest part of the pump change is the sending unit seal, DO NOT INSTALL THE SEAL ON THE SENDING UNIT FOR RE-INSTALLATION, PUT THE SEAL GROOVE ON THE FUEL TANK OPENING LIP! This is the main issue that catches most people as usually the seal come off stuck to the sending unit.

+1 I ended up doing it backwards and couldn't figure out why the pump wouldn't seat. It's very weird but in a way it won't let you reinstall the pump with the seal seated incorrectly. Unless you force it.

Originally Posted by TonyJ

Can you share some experience how you did that? I was stuck by the wiring harness. The pump relay is visible, but the horn is definately unaccessible. I think I need to remove the 3 black harness plugs from the white housing. But they are damn tight. There would be some sort of locking tabs but I just can't find them. How do you guys do it?

I managed to get it out last night after some grief. You have to remove the nut that secures the relay panel at the bottom, and then there are two snap-in clips that hold it in place at the top. I couldn't get to the one on the right, but I unhooked the left one, and then I was able to pull the panel down enough to get the fuel pump relay out. I didn't try to pull the horn relay - it hasn't seen near as much use. Have plenty of beer handy.

My car has almost 240,000 miles on it.

I recently replaced all 6 coils and spark plugs and the valve cover gasket. A few days later the car started misfiring.

I scanned the code and it showed a fault in the intake camshaft position sensor so I replaced it and no change, still misfiring.

I took it to a local shop who said they did a compression test, checked the engine/coils with an oscilliscope and thought they found a loose ground. 6 hours of labor they said it was fixed. Got the car back and that afternoon, same problem returned but this time worse!
It only appears when the car is hot, after being driven for about 30 minutes it starts knocking. When the car is cold it drives perfectly.

I'm bringing the car back to them tomorrow and now I'm thinking maybe I should have them replace the fuel pump, relay and filter just incase. Anyone have any ideas?

Originally Posted by ct323i

My car has almost 240,000 miles on it.

I recently replaced all 6 coils and spark plugs and the valve cover gasket. A few days later the car started misfiring.

I scanned the code and it showed a fault in the intake camshaft position sensor so I replaced it and no change, still misfiring.

I took it to a local shop who said they did a compression test, checked the engine/coils with an oscilliscope and thought they found a loose ground. 6 hours of labor they said it was fixed. Got the car back and that afternoon, same problem returned but this time worse!
It only appears when the car is hot, after being driven for about 30 minutes it starts knocking. When the car is cold it drives perfectly.

I'm bringing the car back to them tomorrow and now I'm thinking maybe I should have them replace the fuel pump, relay and filter just incase. Anyone have any ideas?

I think you should replace those items yourself. And the pump and filter can definitely cause misfiring. Make sure you replace your vacuum lines particularly at the SAP, F-connector at intake elbow, and intake elbows themselves. The fact it happens as the car gets hot leads me to believe it's something thats reactive to heat which can often times be vacuum leaks.

Originally Posted by E46Mango

I think you should replace those items yourself. And the pump and filter can definitely cause misfiring. Make sure you replace your vacuum lines particularly at the SAP, F-connector at intake elbow, and intake elbows themselves. The fact it happens as the car gets hot leads me to believe it's something thats reactive to heat which can often times be vacuum leaks.

I did find a cracked lower intake boot and replaced both that and the upper intake boot a couple months ago. The F connector seemed okay.

SAP, never replaced that to my knowledge.

I do have a small crack in the vent hose from Valve Cover to Oil Separator, my friend told me that should just be an exhaust vent and shouldn't matter that much... do you think that could be a cause of the misfire?