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General E46 Forum
This is the place to get answers, opinions and everything you need related to your E46 (sedan, coupe, convertible and wagon) BMW!

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Old 07-16-2012, 11:24 PM   #141
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Old 07-16-2012, 11:29 PM   #142
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That's what I was thinking... I'll call an Indy shop to see if that's legit. My dads cautious about Indy shops though
Well, the bad news - HPFP for 760 costs $2000 (bmwmercedesparts.com). So ###ing expensive! The good news - it is not 7k. Labor can't cost 5k, this is for sure.

Note to myself: stay away from these 'luxury' junk, no wonder they depreciate so fast.
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Old 07-16-2012, 11:50 PM   #143
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Originally Posted by Nervous View Post
Well, the bad news - HPFP for 760 costs $2000 (bmwmercedesparts.com). So ###ing expensive! The good news - it is not 7k. Labor can't cost 5k, this is for sure.

Note to myself: stay away from these 'luxury' junk, no wonder they depreciate so fast.
Ok thanks man I'll take a look. Is it 2k for each pump? 760i have two fuel pumps. Either way it's a rip off
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Old 07-16-2012, 11:54 PM   #144
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Ok thanks man I'll take a look. Is it 2k for each pump? 760i have two fuel pumps. Either way it's a rip off
I am not very familiar with 760, but as far as I understand there is one HFPF and one in-tank fuel pump (that costs $255 at thebmwpartstore.com).
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Old 07-16-2012, 11:56 PM   #145
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Ahh no!! Two pumps required. ~$2,200 each plus labor. Looks like the dealership wasn't too far off.

http://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/sho...d.php?t=389398
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Old 07-16-2012, 11:57 PM   #146
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Good thing I dont have to pay for that one. Guess my dad isn't retiring anytime soon
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Old 07-17-2012, 12:02 AM   #147
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Even if so, still not even close to 7k. Simple math 2k + 2k = 4k. 7k - 4k = 3k for nothing. Again, the labor cant cost 3k.
And I highly doubt that both HFPF are out: stealer is just lazy to test which one is failing and it is easier for him to replace both 'just in case'. Plus, good profit. That is why they are called 'stealers'.

Last edited by Nervous; 07-17-2012 at 12:05 AM.
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Old 07-17-2012, 12:28 AM   #148
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Is it better to change the pump when the gas tank is almost empty or it does not matter?
Will I need a new clamp or be able to reuse old one?
Anything to avoid incorrect fuel gauge reading after the replacement?
Thanx
since nobody answered i will answer my own ?-s having just completed the replacement.

my fuel tank was 1/2 full and still the gas was "right there", so I would not do it on full tank.

Used new clamp

Fuel gauge seems to be working correctly after replacement

Rubber ring was a pain to install and kept sliding off and definitely needs to go on the tank first and not on the pump

DIY is on youtube, search for "e46 fuel pump", all you need.
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Old 07-17-2012, 05:43 AM   #149
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CokMinus - JFOJ that Mango refers to is the first link below in my signature. Make sure you are using a computer and not a phone to read these messages as you will not see the signatures on a phone.

Nervous - A few issues, not sure, but it is possible that your dads car is a SULEV car?? If so, all SULEV components are warrantied for 15 years / 150k miles. This is something to clearly check into. The other issue is there has been a VERY high failure rate of the HPFP in the E9x series cars and it may be a similar pump in your dads car? I would be contacting BMW NA as they may pay for some or all of the repair, but the car is 7 years old, so it may be barking up a tree.

I would get the car away from the dealer if there is no help from BMW NA and get an indy to do the job. If the 760 is like all the other cars, you can probably replace the pump from inside the car???

Hanna, sorry I did not get back to you. You can typically replace the pumps with 3/4 or less fuel in the tank, the less the better. More than 3/4 tank, when you open up the top of the tank, you will have quite a bit of fuel pour out, luckily it will not pour into the car, but all over the top of the tank and it will leak all over the ground. Yes, get a new clamp. You MUST put the rubber seal on the lip of the tank opening, NOT on the fuel pump.

As for a DIY, there are plenty out there and this is a really easy job except for the fuel pump gasket. On the E39's I slide the pump through the gasket, get the float and float arm into the tank, then slide the gasket back down and insert the groove in the side on the tank opening lip, not sure this is as easy on the E46, may be best just to put the gasket on the tank first, but it depending on how much room you need to work the pump into the tank.
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Old 07-17-2012, 11:19 AM   #150
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So reading through 7 pages of this is nice and all, but how about a link to a DIY in the OP, OP? That would be nice, since you are urging us all to do it.
found TKC's thread from a while back, should still be applicable today.

http://forum.e46fanatics.com/showthr...414&highlight=

Subcribed for later use. I think I'm showing signs of fuel pump failure. I haven't driven it much lately and I started it this past weekend and the car was idling rough and was shaking for a few minutes. It settled down after a while and eventually had a smooth idle and was back to normal. CPS, intake boot, CCV unit, and fuel filter have been replaced and are fairly new(less that 30k miles of use) so looks like my fuel pump is right on schedule. Thanks for the post OP.
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Old 07-17-2012, 03:00 PM   #151
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good post. This absolutely needs to be done. Anybody who disagrees, step up. There is no reason not to do this.
sulev m56? :p
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Old 07-17-2012, 03:38 PM   #152
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my fuel pump went out around 160K, wife's got 150K still going on original fuel pump. Getting nervous as it is our vacation car, so I may be doing this soon regardless....
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Old 07-18-2012, 07:40 AM   #153
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Ahh no!! Two pumps required. ~$2,200 each plus labor. Looks like the dealership wasn't too far off.

http://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/sho...d.php?t=389398
Holy sh!t good enough reason never to buy a 760 until you're ballin and that's chump change
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Old 07-18-2012, 08:53 AM   #154
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A day after the pump replacement filled the car up and the gas started pouring from underneath the car. Not good. I thought I reinstalled the gasket correctly but apparently not. I opened the cover up and sure enough the gas was sipping from that gasket. Lost quite a bit of gas. The old gasket was stretched and probably got jammed somewhere. Bought a new one today, $27 (oh well), and will be reinstalling it in the evening. I would recommend getting a NEW gasket if you do this repair!
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Old 07-18-2012, 09:04 AM   #155
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Hanna,

Your old gasket is probably fine.

The usual problem is most people put the gasket on the sending unit/cover and then install the pump and gasket into the tank. THIS IS NOT THE CORRECT WAY TO INSTALL THE GASKET!!

You will see small cut or groove in the outer edge of the gasket, this cut or groove needs to be installed on the lip of the fuel tank opening, then the pump is dropped into the gasket while it is installed on the fuel tank lip.

Sometimes it is a bit tricky to feed the float and float arm into the tank with the gasket on installed on the tank lip, at least my E39 M5 is this way, so I thread the pump through the gasket, then feed the float and float arm into the tank, snap the pump into the bottom of the tank, at least my M5 needs the actual pump snapped into the bottom tank baffle, not sure the standard E46 is this way, then I slide the gasket down the pump housing and install the gasket on the lip of the fuel tank opening, then seat the pump.

What throws a lot of people is usually when you remove the sending unit, the gasket sticks to the sending unit and pulls out of the tank, so many try to install the gasket mounted on the sending unit.

AGAIN, THE GASKET IS NOT INSTALLED ON THE SENDING UNIT/COVER, IT MUST BE INSTALLED ON THE FUEL TANK OPENING LIP, THE FUEL TANK LIP SLIPS INTO THE SLIT IN THE SIDE OF THE GASKET!
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Fuel pump failures - http://forum.e46fanatics.com/showthread.php?t=929501

Temp Info - http://forum.e46fanatics.com/showthread.php?t=964491

Hidden OBC Menu - Check Voltage, Temps, Fuel Level - http://forum.e46fanatics.com/showthread.php?t=239619

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Old 07-18-2012, 10:50 PM   #156
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Fixed my mistake today. I installed the gasket upside down yesterday! The crazy thing is that it kinda fit but obviously was leaking. Filled her up today and all is good. Stupid girls ( like me) should probably not work on cars but on the other hand you live and learn :-)
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Old 07-19-2012, 12:38 AM   #157
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Old 07-19-2012, 11:23 AM   #158
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Great post OP. I agree doing a PM on FP and other key component parts that when they fail will get your stranded, is a smart thing to do.

Op based on your explanation below of what a soft failure does, am I correct to think that soft failure is caused by the bad non-elec pump rather than elec pump that's being discussed in your thread?

"Note about soft failures on the fuel pump

Some of the fuel pumps are soft failing. This means they work and you do not have issues starting your car, but they can cause intermittent hesitation, misfiring, stalling as well as problems running out of fuel when the tank is about 1/4 full. This is due to low pressure and/or volume causing the siphon or suction jet pump that transfers fuel from one side of the tank to the pump side to not transfer fuel correctly. What happens is you still have fuel in the non electric pump side, but the electric pump side runs out of fuel. This usually happens with 1/4 of fuel showing on the gauge. The hesitation, misfiring and stalling is usually again to low pressure and/or volume from a weak fuel pump."
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Old 07-19-2012, 11:51 AM   #159
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Mike.Santos999,

Clarification on soft fail fuel pump. This does not have anything to do with the passive/siphon pump in the drivers side of the fuel tank.

The soft fail is with the electric fuel pump located in the passenger side of the fuel tank (left hand drive cars), usually reduced pressure and volume which causes the passive/siphon pump not to work correctly. This can also be due to a badly restricted fuel filter as well. What we are seeing with the soft fail on the electric fuel pumps may be caused due to back inlet check valves, worn internal bearings or worn impeller parts. These issues seem to cause the fuel pressure and volume to be reduced and the side effects tend to be poor idle, possible lean codes, hard starting, poor/jerky acceleration and in more severe cases problems with the passive/siphon pump properly transferring fuel from the drivers side of the tank to the passenger side of the tank.

My recommendation for anyone who ends up running out of fuel when the gas gauge shows 1/4 tank is to replace the electric fuel pump and filter as this is a pretty textbook case of soft failure on the main electric pump.
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Fuel pump failures - http://forum.e46fanatics.com/showthread.php?t=929501

Temp Info - http://forum.e46fanatics.com/showthread.php?t=964491

Hidden OBC Menu - Check Voltage, Temps, Fuel Level - http://forum.e46fanatics.com/showthread.php?t=239619

E46/E39 GM5 Door Lock Info - www.bmwgm5.com

Lower hose fan switch O-ring - BMW #13621743299

Last edited by jfoj; 07-19-2012 at 11:52 AM.
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Old 07-19-2012, 11:53 AM   #160
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Mike.Santos999,

Clarification on soft fail fuel pump. This does not have anything to do with the passive/siphon pump in the drivers side of the fuel tank.

The soft fail is with the electric fuel pump located in the passenger side of the fuel tank (left hand drive cars), usually reduced pressure and volume which causes the passive/siphon pump not to work correctly. This can also be due to a badly restricted fuel filter as well. What we are seeing with the soft fail on the electric fuel pumps may be caused due to back inlet check valves, worn internal bearings or worn impeller parts. These issues seem to cause the fuel pressure and volume to be reduced and the side effects tend to be poor idle, possible lean codes, hard starting, poor/jerky acceleration and in more severe cases problems with the passive/siphon pump properly transferring fuel from the drivers side of the tank to the passenger side of the tank.

My recommendation for anyone who ends up running out of fuel when the gas gauge shows 1/4 tank is to replace the electric fuel pump and filter as this is a pretty textbook case of soft failure on the main electric pump.
+1. Bottom line is worn fuel pump and filter can and will cause your fuel volume, consistency, and pressure to be compromised.
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