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General E46 Forum
This is the place to get answers, opinions and everything you need related to your E46 (sedan, coupe, convertible and wagon) BMW!

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Old 10-09-2012, 12:26 AM   #81
TonyJ
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Originally Posted by WDE46 View Post
I don't hear much of the impeller disintegrating.
How about this?
http://www.e46fanatics.com/forum/sho...&postcount=594
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Old 10-09-2012, 04:05 AM   #82
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Only now once I have some people listening and agreeing with me was I able to vote 5 stars on this thread. Thanks to a bunch of people for having an open mind. I especially liked the post by Zell about not needing to replace your whole cooling system when your temp sensor O-ring has a leak... got a kick out of that.
The funny thing is, that actually happened in a thread not too long ago...

I respect the guy, he has made a lot of great contributions to the community, but I think it has gone to his head to the point that he is being plain nuts about it. It's beginning to bother people, even me, and I don't get annoyed easily.
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Old 10-15-2012, 05:29 PM   #83
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I've had 3 BMWs, I've had the waterpump and other various cooling parts go bad on all 3. There is just no excuse anymore, go read the e90 and f30 forums, even the new electric pumps are failing prematurely. Maybe time to look into Infiniti
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Old 10-15-2012, 05:33 PM   #84
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Hush your mouth!
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Old 10-15-2012, 05:38 PM   #85
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I've had 3 BMWs, I've had the waterpump and other various cooling parts go bad on all 3. There is just no excuse anymore, go read the e90 and f30 forums, even the new electric pumps are failing prematurely. Maybe time to look into Infiniti
Ignorant comment is ignorant. You had failures because you didn't maintain your car. Period. My family's brand new Infiniti G37 had its transmission replaced under warranty because of a failed cooling system. Nissan/Infiniti's VQ-based engines and automatic transmissions are notorious for its ruptured oil fittings sending coolant into the transmission and the other way around.

No car make is immune to problems. This happened to two other friends with brand new Nissans. Don't get me started how many times my E46 had to rescue that brand new Infiniti for other problems I won't even get started on.

The cooling system in the E46 is beyond excellent in every way. It just takes maintenance. Don't bad-mouth the brand due to your own failure to perform basic maintenance.

Maintain your cooling system and you'll never experience a problem. Simple as that.
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Old 10-15-2012, 06:08 PM   #86
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we all think that the e46 cooling system is bound to fail because we ALL SHARE OUR failures here, if we began to see how much in repairs every cars cost you wouldnt talk about BMW in the first place because all i see in front of repair shops now days is some american and loads of japanese cars sitting waiting to be serviced while people complain how BMW is bad on here because they never really get out and see that BMW in general isnt that bad to maintain at all as oppose to other makers out there
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Old 10-15-2012, 06:30 PM   #87
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Scotty Kilmer ripped pretty hard on the M54 cooling system.



I also don't recommend some of the fixes he's suggested in the past...
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Old 10-15-2012, 06:44 PM   #88
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Scotty Kilmer ripped pretty hard on the M54 cooling system.



I also don't recommend some of the fixes he's suggested in the past...
this niqqa lmao bmw aint the only fawking one look the toyota or many other manufactures they will alll use plastic in their cars and they wont be so rolling 30 years later
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Old 10-15-2012, 06:56 PM   #89
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I'm paraphrasing myself when I say this:

The E46 Cooling System...
It is not for us to question, but for us to maintain.

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Old 10-15-2012, 08:04 PM   #90
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Very interesting. I have a 330ci 2006 that could mean this applies to me? Im a first time bmw owner

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Old 10-15-2012, 08:16 PM   #91
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All of this applies to everyone who owned an E46. BMW upgraded some cooling system components after-the-fact (e.g. expansion tank). Your water pump is probably fine, though. It's a composite material. You should at the very least do the new expansion tank, just since it is improved.
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Old 10-15-2012, 09:14 PM   #92
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Ignorant comment is ignorant. You had failures because you didn't maintain your car. Period. My family's brand new Infiniti G37 had its transmission replaced under warranty because of a failed cooling system. Nissan/Infiniti's VQ-based engines and automatic transmissions are notorious for its ruptured oil fittings sending coolant into the transmission and the other way around.

No car make is immune to problems. This happened to two other friends with brand new Nissans. Don't get me started how many times my E46 had to rescue that brand new Infiniti for other problems I won't even get started on.

The cooling system in the E46 is beyond excellent in every way. It just takes maintenance. Don't bad-mouth the brand due to your own failure to perform basic maintenance.

Maintain your cooling system and you'll never experience a problem. Simple as that.
I could maintain a supermarine spitfire with the same type of preventative maintenance as you suggest.. but at what cost. Fact is I don't know anyone with Honda, Toyota, Nissan who have had wp failures or have had to do religious preventative maintenance on such items. Except maybe VW but they are a whole different discussion
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Old 10-15-2012, 09:31 PM   #93
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I could maintain a supermarine spitfire with the same type of preventative maintenance as you suggest.. but at what cost. Fact is I don't know anyone with Honda, Toyota, Nissan who have had wp failures or have had to do religious preventative maintenance on such items. Except maybe VW but they are a whole different discussion
Gonna sell your car?
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Old 10-15-2012, 10:05 PM   #94
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I could maintain a supermarine spitfire with the same type of preventative maintenance as you suggest.. but at what cost. Fact is I don't know anyone with Honda, Toyota, Nissan who have had wp failures or have had to do religious preventative maintenance on such items. Except maybe VW but they are a whole different discussion
I know plenty of Toyotas and Hondas with failed cooling systems--hell I've had a couple myself! You think Toyotas and Hondas, Nissans don't need cooling maintenance? Should I post a picture of my friend's Toyota corolla with steam coming out of the hood? I see Japanese cars stranded/overheated on the side of the road all the time. Nobody is immune.

Read my cooling thread, I talk about why it's a problem for BMWs more so than for other cars.

Also not sure why you call maintaining a BMW cooling system "religious," when most people don't need to do their cooling systems more than once... twice at the most. Every 60-75k--too much to ask?
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Old 10-15-2012, 10:06 PM   #95
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Oh oh oh and BTW, even if it were true that Corollas, Camrys, and Accords were bulletproof... do you really want to drive one?? Not sure what the point is there...
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Old 10-15-2012, 10:38 PM   #96
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Find me a car out there that does not use plastics in 90% of their cooling system. I have posted extensively about why plastics are NOT a cheaper solution for car makers, and why they like to use them anyway, but I will just give you the broad view:
- The capital costs for plastic molds are HUGE. The one for the thermostat housing would easily be a $750k mold. And you can't just have one. They probably have a dozen. And when they stop making e46 thermostat housings, that mold is just scrap steel, because the only thing it can do is make e46 thermostat housings. Not to mention, the molds wear out. There is a limited number of parts that can be made before it is too worn to produce the dimensionally correct part. Plastic is abrasive to the mold. That single part has probably cost BMW millions of dollars in molds alone.

So, why use them?
- The parts come out of the mold ready to use, for the most part. No machining, no plating, painting, anodizing or other finish required. The same part made from aluminum is labor intensive. It requires casting, then machining operations, then finishing operations. Each of these steps introduces the chance for human error, scrapped parts loss, and dimensional variances, not to mention transportation from one facility to another. But, a part made in a properly operated plastic mold will have almost zero scrap loss, and will come out of the mold complete, and dimensionally correct, each one the same as the other. There is almost no dimensional variance.

Now, you are correct in stating that they will not last like metal parts, but they will outlive the warranty period. And yes, that is all they care about. But this has added a new type of preventative maintenance to cars, because you now have to replace parts based on age, and not because of a failure. It is now just a fact of life that this is the way things will be from now on. It sucks, but it will not stop. In fact, it will expand to other parts as time goes by.
So plastic is cheaper to produce than metal ..and plastic will not outlive the warranty period, which then contributes to BMW's bottom line then ? I think you've just contradicted yourself
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Old 10-15-2012, 10:38 PM   #97
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Oh oh oh and BTW, even if it were true that Corollas, Camrys, and Accords were bulletproof... do you really want to drive one?? Not sure what the point is there...
+1 but I have to admit I like the styling of the new accords just coupe tho. Don't hit me
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Old 10-28-2012, 12:48 AM   #98
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Originally Posted by E46Mango View Post

Also not sure why you call maintaining a BMW cooling system "religious," when most people don't need to do their cooling systems more than once... twice at the most. Every 60-75k--too much to ask?
But on cars of the past, you never really had to replace your whole cooling system every 60 or even 100k miles. You just never did that. If anything, you replaced a rubber cooling hose or two at most. With these plastic systems, to be safe, you have to replace every component at 75k or else your at high risk. Really high risk. It's almost certain. For people who have owned cars with the durable old school style cooling systems, we know that there IS better out there and we aren't quick to except what we get here with the E46. This is just the reality of it. My last car was a 92' Maxima. I owned it from 137k till 200k. Do you know what I did to the cooling system on it? Absolutely nothing. I owned a 93' model as well, and a radiator hose went out at 110k. Since owning my E46, I have been plagued with nothing but cooling issues. Im not going to even go into the retarded expansion tank idea. What was the point of this again? Was the conventional system with a radiator and one thermostat working so poorly in the past? If I knew about these wonderful plastic cooling systems when I bought the car, and that it needs to be fully overhauled, I would have done so, but I wasn't aware of full 65-75k cooling system overhaul. My damn plastic intake manifold even started to have a vacuum leak because of cracks. When the car was 8 years old. Seriously.. Wtf?... Oh and I remember a few years back, I overheated in heavy traffic on a commercial bridge.. I eventually pulled up behind the car that was causing the traffic... It was an E46. It was her ET. We had a few things in common.

And did you really see those modern Japanese cars stranded on the side of the road?
It seems the only people that see these sort of anomalies, from my experience anyway, are german car owners

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zell View Post
Scotty Kilmer ripped pretty hard on the M54 cooling system.



I also don't recommend some of the fixes he's suggested in the past...
Good video, but the coolant hoses really arent expensive. Don't talk smack Scotty.
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Old 10-28-2012, 01:20 AM   #99
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funny, my 2 bmw's are the ONLY radiators I've ever replaced...

I've worn out 20 cars in my life, starting with a 1965 datsun pickup that had 400,000 miles on it with the original radiator and in the 300K I drove it the same water pump, the same window regulators, etc etc....

Its all relative I guess...

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Old 10-28-2012, 11:11 AM   #100
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As it's been said many times there is no mystery in building a cooling system that lasts - see post above. A higher quality cooling system (better materials, that is) simply costs more money, BMW doesn't want to spend the extra money when plastic does just fine through the warranty period.

You'll never convince Mango though, he's drunk on the BMW Kool-aid.

In Arizona you'll see plenty of cars, all makes, on the side of the highway during the brutal summer months. However, I could swear I've seen more BMWs than any other make combined.

.

Last edited by klax; 10-28-2012 at 11:16 AM.
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