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Old 04-27-2008, 10:28 PM   #1
NorCal Einstein
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A fix for brake squeal?

Hey guys,

I installed new Axxis pads and rotors a little more then 700 miles ago, and I've been getting major squealing under light braking and in particular, the final feet of movement before coming to a complete stop.

I spent a few hours yesterday removing the calipers and pads, cleaning the pads, calipers and rotors, and then putting CRC disc brake quiet on the back of the pads. Things were silent for all of 2 miles, and the dreaded squeak came back.

I gave plenty of time for the CRC disc brake quite to dry up as suggested, but still no luck.

My car sounds like an absolute hoopty right now, and I'm getting the wrong kind of attention at stoplights

Anyone have any solutions to this? I'd love to get this fixed before Fest, or I'll have to rock some signs in the windows..."Please don't hate me, its not my fault they squeek, its the pads."

Thanks!
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Old 04-27-2008, 10:38 PM   #2
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i need a fix for this also, as i too have axxis deluxe pads on OEM rotors. i was told to try bedding them in again, and i did a couple of times, but my brakes still squeak a bit. what gives?
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Old 04-27-2008, 10:43 PM   #3
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So from my research, squeaking at low speeds/light braking is the vibration of the pad.

I originally thought squeaking was caused by the brake pads squeaking against the rotor, but it is suppose to be from the back of the pad against the caliper.
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Old 04-27-2008, 11:52 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NorCal Einstein View Post
So from my research, squeaking at low speeds/light braking is the vibration of the pad.

I originally thought squeaking was caused by the brake pads squeaking against the rotor, but it is suppose to be from the back of the pad against the caliper.
I have the same issue with my Hawk Performance Ceramic Street pads. I know squeal under light pressure is common with a low dust ceramic pad, and i did use a anti squeal adhesive, during the install. But my car does sound like a train when it comes to a stop sometimes...

Is their a potential solution to the problem?
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Old 04-28-2008, 12:01 AM   #5
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I've been doing a lot of searching, and people are throwing ideas around using various anti-seize compounds and anti-squeal compounds but nothing seems promising.

From what I can gather, the bottom line is that the use of a "shim kit" could permanently put an end to the sound of dragging children against concrete. the shim kit is basically a fiber pad that goes between the back of the brake bad and the brake caliper.

Now, I don't believe there are skim kits for our cars, so that crosses this solution off the list.

I came across this site:
http://www.yankeecruisah.com/brake_squeal.html

which basically has you using duct tape as a shim. This is the most promising to me at this point, and is something that I am going to try tomorrow or Tuesday. I've ran my brakes long enough that I can see where the caliper is pushing on the pad, so I'm going to skip steps 3 and 4 on that site, and just trim the duct tape out of the area where the caliper presses on the pad.

This seems like the best solution for me right now. My brakes are a radioactive orange color from all the anti squeal compound, and all it does is get everything messy and doesn't last very long. With the duct tape, I'll use some black color tape and take care of business that way. The tape should act as a buffer between metal on metal contact and end this squealing business once and for all.

I have a feeling that OEM pads have some kind of softer compound, or built in shim that prevents this from happening, something that after-market pads don't have.

I was hoping there was someone in here with a solution to my problem, but I guess all I found were people with the same issues!
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Old 04-28-2008, 12:13 AM   #6
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Interesting read. I was certain that buying ceramic pads would stop the squeal, but I'm certainly convinced otherwise now. Let us know how that duct tape fix works.
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Old 04-28-2008, 12:21 AM   #7
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Interesting...

My Hawk pads, have a similar "shimmy" on the back of the pad. I used a very good anti squeal adhesive as well, its a clear spray on and it actually worked very well. I think the combination on the incorporated shimmy on the pad and the anti-squeal adhesive is doing its job. I just think that the squeal is a trade off for the harder compound low dust ceramic pads that i used instead of the OEM pads. Its a very common issue with after market pads....

Quote:
Originally Posted by NorCal Einstein View Post
I've been doing a lot of searching, and people are throwing ideas around using various anti-seize compounds and anti-squeal compounds but nothing seems promising.

From what I can gather, the bottom line is that the use of a "shim kit" could permanently put an end to the sound of dragging children against concrete. the shim kit is basically a fiber pad that goes between the back of the brake bad and the brake caliper.

Now, I don't believe there are skim kits for our cars, so that crosses this solution off the list.

I came across this site:
http://www.yankeecruisah.com/brake_squeal.html

which basically has you using duct tape as a shim. This is the most promising to me at this point, and is something that I am going to try tomorrow or Tuesday. I've ran my brakes long enough that I can see where the caliper is pushing on the pad, so I'm going to skip steps 3 and 4 on that site, and just trim the duct tape out of the area where the caliper presses on the pad.

This seems like the best solution for me right now. My brakes are a radioactive orange color from all the anti squeal compound, and all it does is get everything messy and doesn't last very long. With the duct tape, I'll use some black color tape and take care of business that way. The tape should act as a buffer between metal on metal contact and end this squealing business once and for all.

I have a feeling that OEM pads have some kind of softer compound, or built in shim that prevents this from happening, something that after-market pads don't have.

I was hoping there was someone in here with a solution to my problem, but I guess all I found were people with the same issues!
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Old 04-28-2008, 12:57 AM   #8
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I have this same problem, I though about getting the brass, caliper pin guides from Turner Motorsports, but I also don't feel like greasing my caliper pins ever 3k miles.....

Interested in the results of the duct tape. I'm sure there is some type of tape, or adhesive that would be better than duct tape though. I would just feel silly putting duct tape on my car.
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Old 04-28-2008, 01:12 AM   #9
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I'll be using Gorilla tape if it makes any difference. I just can't stand the noise from my brakes.

My Superleggeras' are a pain to clean as well!

The Axxis pads were advertised on ModBargains as a no squeal pad, I bought them because it seemed like people were content with what they had. I'll give the tape a try, and if that doesn't work, I'm up for 1 more solution and if that doesn't stop it....

I'm WheelWaxing the wheels and putting OEM pads back on. Then I'm setting fire to the Axxis pads.
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Old 04-28-2008, 07:05 AM   #10
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You guys need to provide feedback to potential future purchasers of the aftermarket brake pad products you bought and let them know about the noise problems associated with these products.

Some products in particular have well known brake noise problems (do a little searching on Axxis). The problem is that on many, the people who buy them and then suffer the problems don't provide that feedback enough.

You're serious about using duct tape in your brake pad installation?

Wouldn't a set of OE pads make more sense?
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Old 04-28-2008, 11:44 PM   #11
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Update:

So sometime between my post last night and today, I realized that tape would not stand up to the heat that brakes are subject to. I thought about all the stuff I had read on the web, and there was mention about making sure to grease "caliper pins".

I wasn't familiar with the term "caliper pins" because all the DIY threads I've read never used that term. I'm thinking back to the original DIY I used, and I remember that the bolts used to hold the caliper to the carrier were not regular ones, and had a lot of smooth surface.

So I went ahead and assumed these bolts were "caliper pins", and decided I should grease them.

The bolts look like the ones pictured here (courtesy of MadRussian for pictures)


I used CRC Synthetic brake grease that I got at AutoZone.


I was VERY liberal with the grease on the caliper bolts and reinstalled them. Once I got them in, everything was quiet.

Please note, I STILL have CRC Brake Quiet on the backs of my brake pads


What I did was apply Brake Quiet to the areas of that pad that came into contact with the caliper, again..being liberal with the amount of orange goo used. Then I let it set for 10 minutes. This is the important part, you MUST let the orange goop stuff set before you use your brakes. I let the goop set for 10 minutes with the pads off the caliper, and then the car sat for 20 minutes after I installed everything. If you don't let the goop set, it will push out and render useless.

When I was greasing my caliper bolts, I checked the goop on my brake pads, and they had held up since I let everything dry.
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Old 04-29-2008, 12:18 AM   #12
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^^^ so you no longer have a squeak, at all? and what kinda rotors do you have, OEM? i'll do exactly as you did, and hopefully will be able to resolve my squeak issue as well.
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Old 04-29-2008, 12:20 AM   #13
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I'm running Brembo blank which have been slotted with Axxis Deluxe pads.

I haven't done a lot of driving today, but I've tried to get the system to squeak without success!

I really believe that the combination of the orange goop and the grease on the pins did the trick.
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Old 04-29-2008, 01:04 AM   #14
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where do you put the plastic caps? what are they for? important or not? I saw one came off my brake. Thanks.
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Old 04-29-2008, 01:08 AM   #15
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The plastic caps ARE important. They prevent dust and debris from getting lodged between the caliper pin and the caliper.

Ken, I replied to your PM. Best of luck!
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Old 04-29-2008, 01:59 AM   #16
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Thanks for the info, dude. I will bookmark this thread and come back to it when I get the time to do a brake pad change. Props!

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Old 04-29-2008, 02:34 AM   #17
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I just installed Akebono pads on Brembo blank rotors, and used BG Stop Squeal on the pads. No squealing with about 500 miles on the new setup. I used to use the Stop Squeal on customers cars when I worked for Ford. Never got any complaints.
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Old 04-29-2008, 06:18 AM   #18
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Everytime you do a brake job you should clean and regrease the caliper guide pins aka sliders as this will preent squealing and seizing up of the caliper.

I never have hadany comebacks due to squealing/noise related issues and I do this on a daily basis at work.

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Old 04-29-2008, 11:21 AM   #19
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Towards the end of my drive into work, the system started squealing again...

I don't know if I should ride out for a hundred miles or so, or start tearing down the brakes again...
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Old 04-30-2008, 12:29 AM   #20
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Alright...

The squeaking pissed me off really bad today, so I tore down the brakes once again tonight.

This time, the calipers and pads came off.

I hit any metal to metal contact point with a lot of the grease I posted above. I covered practically the entire backs of the brake pads in grease, and then the areas where the pads met the caliper. Regreased the caliper bolts as well.

I drove 20 miles after I did this with a mix of city/highway and there were no squeaks.

When I was tearing down the brake system, I did notice that some of the Brake Quiet (orange goop) got pushed out in certain contact points. This could have been the cause of the squeaking.

For the record, I don't like the orange goop stuff very well at all. The grease is my favorite at this moment
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