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Old 10-24-2012, 09:40 PM   #1
pavlo1994
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Rebuilding Motor

Hey guys, I have a 2005 BMW 330i ZHP

I currently have 135k on it.

I have no signs of any noise, leaks or any troubles with the motor *knock on wood* but im thinking about rebuilding the motor over the winter.

I plan to do some track next year after the rebuild ofcourse. I do often try to drive the car hard as well. No not 6800rpms but still hard.

I put together a small list of parts that i need to order.
BTW all the labor will be done by moi.

Parts-
Valve Stem Seals
Crank Bearings
Rod Bearings
Rings
ALL seals and Gaskets.

Can anyone add some upgrades maybe? or something im overlooking?
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Old 10-24-2012, 10:37 PM   #2
cvx5832
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pavlo1994 View Post
Hey guys, I have a 2005 BMW 330i ZHP

I currently have 135k on it.

I have no signs of any noise, leaks or any troubles with the motor *knock on wood* but im thinking about rebuilding the motor over the winter.

I plan to do some track next year after the rebuild ofcourse. I do often try to drive the car hard as well. No not 6800rpms but still hard.

I put together a small list of parts that i need to order.
BTW all the labor will be done by moi.

Parts-
Valve Stem Seals
Crank Bearings
Rod Bearings
Rings
ALL seals and Gaskets.

Can anyone add some upgrades maybe? or something im overlooking?
I may have missed it in your post, but what exactly are you trying to fix? 135k is still pretty young for an M54, especially one that's been cared for.

You have no leaks, noises or performance issues, but you want to rebuild it anyway? Unless you're just looking for something to do, I think the time will be better spent on something else. Not to mention the potential to mess something up with the cam timing.
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Old 10-24-2012, 10:46 PM   #3
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Agreed, especially if you don't even hit the rev limit.
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Old 10-24-2012, 10:54 PM   #4
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Why? If you're just looking for a little winter project and you have the money to blow then sure. Otherwise it sounds like a colossal waste of money. Have you even done any testing or inspection to determine the health of the engine?
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Old 10-25-2012, 02:48 AM   #5
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Sounds like a waste of money, My Car is boosted with the same ammount of miles your cars and i have the orginal motor
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Old 10-25-2012, 04:23 AM   #6
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Alright, the OP is on the hunt for opinions. I would share your concern about doing track work on a sled that has 135k miles on it; it's a legit concern. I think you are concerned about spinning a rod bearing - right? Use Blackstone Labs to analyze the metalurgical content of your oil; through this non-invasive testing, they can determine the copper content in your oil and if it is high, this would be bad news and thus, it validates your rod bearing concern. Speak to Blackstone and communicate your exact concern so they'll test/analyze your oil accordingly. Once you receive the results, then this will help you charter your course.

As far as what's going on in the combustion chamber, have compression test done; if the pressures are good and close to another, that's a good sign. Do you know how to read spark plugs? A rule of thumb is that if the tips have a tanish color to them and there is no residue on the plug, that's another good sign. Now if they are oil fouled, that would be very bad news.

If you really are going to participate in HPDE's, what is your car's cooling, braking and suspension status? Are you on the original radiator? When it comes to suspension, are your RTABs, FCAB, and other bushings in good condition? Hopefully you have a solid coilover such as Bilstein PSS9s/PSS10, Ground Control or TC Klein; this will greatly improve your car's capabilities and your enjoyment of the event. For brakes, get new front rotors like Centric Premiums, Brembo or the like and pair that with a good pad like Pagid RS-19/RS-29 (Yellow Pads) or Porterfield R4-E pads, and Motul 550 or 600 brake fluid; the improved braking will give you a solid grin. These are just a few items to consider.

Last edited by lucky_doggg7; 10-25-2012 at 04:42 AM.
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Old 10-25-2012, 01:29 PM   #7
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Just sounds like a waste of money to me These cars motors go FOREVER if taken care of as far as internals goes Look at Dmaxs Car for example
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Old 10-25-2012, 01:39 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pavlo1994 View Post
2005 BMW 330i ZHP
Don't do anything to the engine. Take that cash and buy some suspension parts like shocks, springs, swaybars, bushings, etc. Don't forget about brakes. You probably won't have much cash leftover but if you do take a few fun driving events over the winter down south or out west.

If you really want to rebuild an engine just to rebuild one I'd start by paying as little as possible for a used/wrecked motor out of another car. Rebuild that so that you can learn, take your time, etc. If that were to ever blow up or break at least you would have your first engine to go back to.

With an engine rebuild my rule of thumb has always been to take your time and your budget and double it... and that's been only on 4-cyl 8-valve motors. Perhaps triple your time on a 6-cyl 24v.

Do you have the tools and facility to work on and rebuild a motor?
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Old 10-25-2012, 02:03 PM   #9
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I wouldn't take the bottom end apart unless you have bad compression numbers. If you want a major project, pull the motor and pop the head off. Replace all the gaskets and seals. Clean everything and replace all of the rubber hoses. Reinstall engine into "good as new" engine bay.

If you mess with the bottom end, you have to deal with all of the tolerances and crap. At 135k, you will probably need some cylinder machining and half over pistons to do it correctly.
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Old 10-26-2012, 01:23 PM   #10
pavlo1994
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lucky_doggg7 View Post
Alright, the OP is on the hunt for opinions. I would share your concern about doing track work on a sled that has 135k miles on it; it's a legit concern. I think you are concerned about spinning a rod bearing - right? Use Blackstone Labs to analyze the metalurgical content of your oil; through this non-invasive testing, they can determine the copper content in your oil and if it is high, this would be bad news and thus, it validates your rod bearing concern. Speak to Blackstone and communicate your exact concern so they'll test/analyze your oil accordingly. Once you receive the results, then this will help you charter your course.

As far as what's going on in the combustion chamber, have compression test done; if the pressures are good and close to another, that's a good sign. Do you know how to read spark plugs? A rule of thumb is that if the tips have a tanish color to them and there is no residue on the plug, that's another good sign. Now if they are oil fouled, that would be very bad news.

If you really are going to participate in HPDE's, what is your car's cooling, braking and suspension status? Are you on the original radiator? When it comes to suspension, are your RTABs, FCAB, and other bushings in good condition? Hopefully you have a solid coilover such as Bilstein PSS9s/PSS10, Ground Control or TC Klein; this will greatly improve your car's capabilities and your enjoyment of the event. For brakes, get new front rotors like Centric Premiums, Brembo or the like and pair that with a good pad like Pagid RS-19/RS-29 (Yellow Pads) or Porterfield R4-E pads, and Motul 550 or 600 brake fluid; the improved braking will give you a solid grin. These are just a few items to consider.

Im definately going to take a look at my compression numbers.
I have done some recent maintenance though.
-Plugs
-Fuel Filters
-Air filters

As far as i know, my cooling system is in good condition. Apparently the owner took care of the issue.

It doesent exactly have alot of vehicle records or anything of that sort.

One of biggest concerns is the fact that is consumes oil.

When the oil is at appropriate level, after 1 thousand miles i will get the light to put oil in.

I have seen some oil on the bottom on the front corner of the pan. The engine itself seems pretty clean.
Brakes seem to be in good condition as well.

The other is the fact that i have a power dip. Sometimes in 2nd gear if you give it gas, about 15% and it gradually climbs from 2k rpms 3-4- 4 1/2 i will feel multiple cuts. Such as a power dip. When accelerating agressively its only felt under 4-5k rpms.
I have not checked the DISA valve due to no time in my schedule, but tomorrow might be the day.

Any input is appreciated.
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Old 10-26-2012, 01:31 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pavlo1994 View Post
Im definately going to take a look at my compression numbers.
I have done some recent maintenance though.
-Plugs
-Fuel Filters
-Air filters

As far as i know, my cooling system is in good condition. Apparently the owner took care of the issue.

It doesent exactly have alot of vehicle records or anything of that sort.

One of biggest concerns is the fact that is consumes oil.

When the oil is at appropriate level, after 1 thousand miles i will get the light to put oil in.

I have seen some oil on the bottom on the front corner of the pan. The engine itself seems pretty clean.
Brakes seem to be in good condition as well.

The other is the fact that i have a power dip. Sometimes in 2nd gear if you give it gas, about 15% and it gradually climbs from 2k rpms 3-4- 4 1/2 i will feel multiple cuts. Such as a power dip. When accelerating agressively its only felt under 4-5k rpms.
I have not checked the DISA valve due to no time in my schedule, but tomorrow might be the day.

Any input is appreciated.
Wasting money. And coming from me, that says a LOT.

Any performance issues you may be experiencing would never be attributable to the mechanical parts (block/pistons/cams/rods/wristpins/bla bla), but seals, sensors, filters, and electronics/software.

You do your vanos yet? Basically if you're looking for a project as others have said, see sig, do it all! Replace all seals (including oil pan gasket). Dropping the front subframe is a task all in itself.

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Old 10-26-2012, 03:36 PM   #12
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My opinion is that without evidence of a problem, or without the requirement to prep for a certain race class, there really isn't a solid reason to rebuild an engine with good performance, regular oil changes, and a good compression test / leakdown test.

Last Lemons race I ran I built a budget motor with new gaskets and we pulled a junker for a spare (did absolutely nothing to it)... the motor we rebuilt lasted 4 hours, the junker lasted the rest of the time and still runs well. Rebuilding something doesn't guarantee no problems.

Suggest quality racing brake pads and suspension and full maintenance to any issues as a good use of time.

Assuming you are not trailering your car and you want to use it for a DD, maintenance on engine support systems is much more important than on the engine itself.

You can also add gadgets like external water pumps, oil cooler, trans cooler, etc for the cost of a rebuilt engine, and those will help everything last longer.

Now to answer your question: I can tell from your question that you've likely never rebuilt an engine before, if you have please excuse the following:

The only thing I order before an engine rebuild is a gasket kit and known replacements like a water pump. Here's why: If you are going to do a quality rebuild you need to either replace every deficiency. You don't know yet if you need to have the block honed or the crank cut, if you need either you will need over-size pistons and rings or undersize bearings. My honest advice is to pull everything apart, Mic(rometer) everything, then make a list and order parts then. So really.. just wait until it's all apart to pull the final trigger... saves shipping costs too.

So a follow-on question is what should you budget, and your list is a great start. While apart you can do mild things like having a machine shop balance the rotating assembly, or check the primary balance on the rods / pistons... a 3+angle valve job is a good item to budget... so really it's not tjust he parts you need to know, it's what you want to spend while it's apart.

If this is your first rebuild I say go for it, it's a very tedious process though, takes a decent shop and quite a few tools you might not have or thought of yet. The good news is Plastigauge is cheap and harbor freight micrometers / digital calipers generally work ok when new.

Last edited by bikesandcars; 10-26-2012 at 03:40 PM.
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Old 10-26-2012, 03:44 PM   #13
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I say just but a low millage S54 & swap it done !

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Old 10-27-2012, 12:03 AM   #14
pavlo1994
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I say just but a low millage S54 & swap it done !

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I thought about it. Wont even lie. Still kicking it around, but most likely that'll be a no.
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Old 10-27-2012, 03:26 AM   #15
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Originally Posted by pavlo1994 View Post
The other is the fact that i have a power dip. Sometimes in 2nd gear if you give it gas, about 15% and it gradually climbs from 2k rpms 3-4- 4 1/2 i will feel multiple cuts. Such as a power dip. When accelerating agressively its only felt under 4-5k rpms.
I have not checked the DISA valve due to no time in my schedule, but tomorrow might be the day.

Any input is appreciated.
That dip is the notorious ZHP 4k rpm power dip. I suggest you go to the ZHP Mafia site, and search it.
There have been a lot of attempts to diagnose and fix it, but the most successful ones are software changes, IIRC.
But, there is lots of info about it on their site.
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