E46 BMW Social Directory E46 FAQ 3-Series Discussion Forums BMW Photo Gallery BMW 3-Series Technical Information E46 Fanatics - The Ultimate BMW Resource BMW Vendors General E46 Forum The Tire Rack's Tire Wheel Forum Forced Induction Forum The Off-Topic The E46 BMW Showroom For Sale, For Trade or Wanting to Buy

Welcome to the E46Fanatics forums. E46Fanatics is the premiere website for BMW 3 series owners around the world with interactive forums, a geographical enthusiast directory, photo galleries, and technical information for BMW enthusiasts.

You are currently viewing our boards as a guest which gives you limited access to view most discussions and access our other features. By joining our free community you will have access to post topics, communicate privately with other members (PM), respond to polls, upload content and access many other special features. Registration is fast, simple and absolutely free so please, join our community today!

If you have any problems with the registration process or your account login, please contact contact us.

Go Back   E46Fanatics > E46 BMW > General E46 Forum

General E46 Forum
This is the place to get answers, opinions and everything you need related to your E46 (sedan, coupe, convertible and wagon) BMW!

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Rate Thread Display Modes
Old 11-16-2012, 06:43 PM   #41
stevodotorg
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Irvine, CA
Posts: 210
My Ride: 02 325i - Manual
Do you think I should purchase the camshaft and housing used? I really don't think I have any other choice. Purchasing new.. I might as well buy a used engine and install it myself.
__________________

Thanks to all e46fanatics and other BMW forum users, without the community, our wallets would be more empty than they already are.
I do ECU Coding, contact me.
stevodotorg is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-16-2012, 07:24 PM   #42
Nerdy46
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: USA
Posts: 837
My Ride: 328i
Im not sure about for BMW's but dont cam caps need to be machined along with the head for tolerance?
Nerdy46 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-16-2012, 07:29 PM   #43
dknightd
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: upstate NY
Posts: 874
My Ride: 2002 330 cic
If this was my car I take a serious look at it and see if was worth saving.
Based on the damage to the cam journal cap, I can only assume the head
cam journal is also severely damaged. If you try to replace the cam and
"surrounding parts" you are likely looking at something that will fail soon.
I'd be looking at the prices of used/new/rebuilt heads.
If you go to the trouble of checking the rest of the engine out, which you probably should
if you plan to keep it, you could have instead have used that time to replace
the engine with a used one.
If it was my car, and I had decided it was worth saving, I think I'd be looking for a used head,
or more likely a complete used engine. Before installing the used engine I'd replace parts that
are easy to do when the engine is out.
There are many e46 that have been in accidents, and totaled, but still have decent engines.
You are looking at significant time and money. Only you can decide if it is worth it, or if it is time to move on
dknightd is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-16-2012, 07:40 PM   #44
lcoleman
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: the barnyard
Posts: 2,447
My Ride: '79 Massey Ferguson
Quote:
Originally Posted by dknightd View Post
I'd be looking at the prices of used/new/rebuilt heads.
If you go to the trouble of checking the rest of the engine out, which you probably should if you plan to keep it, you could have instead have used that time to replace the engine with a used one.
Agreed. A used head is the bare minimum fix imo. Depending on prices and how much time/effort/skill/money you have to spare, a used engine might be the easiest solution.
__________________
lcoleman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-16-2012, 07:56 PM   #45
Nerdy46
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: USA
Posts: 837
My Ride: 328i
Id seriously be considering a rebuild... or a JY motor...
Nerdy46 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-16-2012, 07:56 PM   #46
stevodotorg
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Irvine, CA
Posts: 210
My Ride: 02 325i - Manual
Quote:
Originally Posted by dknightd View Post
If this was my car I take a serious look at it and see if was worth saving.
Based on the damage to the cam journal cap, I can only assume the head
cam journal is also severely damaged. If you try to replace the cam and
"surrounding parts" you are likely looking at something that will fail soon.
I'd be looking at the prices of used/new/rebuilt heads.
If you go to the trouble of checking the rest of the engine out, which you probably should
if you plan to keep it, you could have instead have used that time to replace
the engine with a used one.
If it was my car, and I had decided it was worth saving, I think I'd be looking for a used head,
or more likely a complete used engine. Before installing the used engine I'd replace parts that
are easy to do when the engine is out.
There are many e46 that have been in accidents, and totaled, but still have decent engines.
You are looking at significant time and money. Only you can decide if it is worth it, or if it is time to move on
Quote:
Originally Posted by lcoleman View Post
Agreed. A used head is the bare minimum fix imo. Depending on prices and how much time/effort/skill/money you have to spare, a used engine might be the easiest solution.
Thanks guys, you're right.. better safe than sorry. I've been googling around, but is there anything like an autotrader for totaled cars? The other route would be Bavarian Auto Recycling.. but we are looking at around $1,800 for a tested engine (with 2 year warranty, which does look like) .. I still have to call and check their head prices.. but is a head even worth it? the long block would need to be machined right?
__________________

Thanks to all e46fanatics and other BMW forum users, without the community, our wallets would be more empty than they already are.
I do ECU Coding, contact me.

Last edited by stevodotorg; 11-16-2012 at 08:04 PM.
stevodotorg is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-16-2012, 08:07 PM   #47
Nerdy46
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: USA
Posts: 837
My Ride: 328i
Your short block is probably fine. However if i were to use it id at least clean it out and hone it. A rebuilt head would get you back on the road though. There is an e46 longblock on craigslist near me with a popped HG for $200.... something like that would be good for you.
Nerdy46 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-16-2012, 08:22 PM   #48
dknightd
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: upstate NY
Posts: 874
My Ride: 2002 330 cic
Quote:
Originally Posted by stevodotorg View Post
The other route would be Bavarian Auto Recycling.. but we are looking at around $1,800 for a tested engine (with 2 year warranty, which does look like)
$1800 seems reasonable for used engine with 2 year warranty. In fact, really good. I don't know what "which does look like" means. I also don't know what the 2 year warranty covers, but you should before you buy it.
dknightd is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-16-2012, 08:48 PM   #49
325xittt
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Reading, PA
Posts: 166
My Ride: 2003, 325 XIT
Holly Crap, that's toast. Looks like you lost oil pressure for a bit and spun a bearing or two. You definitely need to figure out why you lost oil pressure. Oil pump I suspect.

Sorry
__________________
325xittt is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-16-2012, 09:38 PM   #50
jjrichar
OEM ///Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Australia
Posts: 221
My Ride: 330 Ci convertible
Hi, after looking at your photos, I agree with a lot with what has be posted above. To me it seems like there has been oil starvation to only a couple of the cam bearings. Not an oil pump, but a foreign body stuck in the oil line going to these individual bearings.

It could have been after the VCG change, but there is a sieve at the start of the oil inlet line to the pump that should stop anything significant even getting to the pump, and hence the rest of the engine. What does the oil filter look like? If something foreign has gone through the pump then you will see a damaged filter.

Regardless, I definitely wouldn't just change the cams/head. Your engine will need to be removed and completely dismantled to clean out anything in there. Otherwise you run a very high risk of failure soon afterwards. The replacement engine for me would be the best route to take.

If you want to have a look at what the whole engine looks like in individual pieces so you can see what your problems are have a look at the link below.

http://forum.e46fanatics.com/showthread.php?t=899347
jjrichar is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-17-2012, 12:46 AM   #51
TitaniumCranium
/// Limitless
 
TitaniumCranium's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Seattle / Sequim
Posts: 3,151
My Ride: 2002 BMW 330Ci
Quote:
Originally Posted by jjrichar View Post
Hi, after looking at your photos, I agree with a lot with what has be posted above. To me it seems like there has been oil starvation to only a couple of the cam bearings. Not an oil pump, but a foreign body stuck in the oil line going to these individual bearings.

It could have been after the VCG change, but there is a sieve at the start of the oil inlet line to the pump that should stop anything significant even getting to the pump, and hence the rest of the engine. What does the oil filter look like? If something foreign has gone through the pump then you will see a damaged filter.

Regardless, I definitely wouldn't just change the cams/head. Your engine will need to be removed and completely dismantled to clean out anything in there. Otherwise you run a very high risk of failure soon afterwards. The replacement engine for me would be the best route to take.

If you want to have a look at what the whole engine looks like in individual pieces so you can see what your problems are have a look at the link below.

http://forum.e46fanatics.com/showthread.php?t=899347
Ditto

If you intend to keep the car around a while and pull a 100k plus additional miles out of it, this is going be more involved. I'm a fanatic, I believe the car is worth it.

The head must come off, the bearings removed and should probably be line-bored to insure that heating that journal hasn't caused the metal to buckle slightly in that area. You're definately all-in on the head. Have it boiled too in order to remove any other crud in the oil/water journals you can't see.

The intake vanos looks oil starved to me also. That's not the way they look.

If it were me, I'd be going into the bottom end fully also. The reason is that something got into the oil line on the wrong side of the filter. The filter should have stopped it. There may be some things about this vehicle that the previous owner didn't quite explain honestly (or knowlegeable enough to know). But I'd be boiling the short block out too.

As a whole, you have a decision to make. A good head with a good cam in it may be less expensive. A junkyard motor is less expensive than a full on rebuild BUT there is a big difference between the two motors when they're finished. One cost 1/2 to 2/3 of the other one, but the rebuild is the only motor that starts out fresh with you knowing everything that went into making that motor run the way it does and can give you the piece of mind that the motor should be good for 250k more miles.
__________________

/// MODS
/// Auto => 6-Spd Manual Conversion | Apex EC-7 | Koni/Ground Control Coilovers | Vorshlag Camber Plates | Meyle HD LCA | PowerFlex bushings | GruppeM CAI | Shark Injector | 6000k HID's and Fogs | BMW European MTechII | BMW Performance Shifter | ACS Mirrors and Rear Spoiler ///
TitaniumCranium is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 11-17-2012, 06:21 PM   #52
stevodotorg
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Irvine, CA
Posts: 210
My Ride: 02 325i - Manual
Quote:
Originally Posted by dknightd View Post
$1800 seems reasonable for used engine with 2 year warranty. In fact, really good. I don't know what "which does look like" means. I also don't know what the 2 year warranty covers, but you should before you buy it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jjrichar View Post
Hi, after looking at your photos, I agree with a lot with what has be posted above. To me it seems like there has been oil starvation to only a couple of the cam bearings. Not an oil pump, but a foreign body stuck in the oil line going to these individual bearings.

It could have been after the VCG change, but there is a sieve at the start of the oil inlet line to the pump that should stop anything significant even getting to the pump, and hence the rest of the engine. What does the oil filter look like? If something foreign has gone through the pump then you will see a damaged filter.

Regardless, I definitely wouldn't just change the cams/head. Your engine will need to be removed and completely dismantled to clean out anything in there. Otherwise you run a very high risk of failure soon afterwards. The replacement engine for me would be the best route to take.

If you want to have a look at what the whole engine looks like in individual pieces so you can see what your problems are have a look at the link below.

http://forum.e46fanatics.com/showthread.php?t=899347
Quote:
Originally Posted by TitaniumCranium View Post
Ditto

If you intend to keep the car around a while and pull a 100k plus additional miles out of it, this is going be more involved. I'm a fanatic, I believe the car is worth it.

The head must come off, the bearings removed and should probably be line-bored to insure that heating that journal hasn't caused the metal to buckle slightly in that area. You're definately all-in on the head. Have it boiled too in order to remove any other crud in the oil/water journals you can't see.

The intake vanos looks oil starved to me also. That's not the way they look.

If it were me, I'd be going into the bottom end fully also. The reason is that something got into the oil line on the wrong side of the filter. The filter should have stopped it. There may be some things about this vehicle that the previous owner didn't quite explain honestly (or knowlegeable enough to know). But I'd be boiling the short block out too.

As a whole, you have a decision to make. A good head with a good cam in it may be less expensive. A junkyard motor is less expensive than a full on rebuild BUT there is a big difference between the two motors when they're finished. One cost 1/2 to 2/3 of the other one, but the rebuild is the only motor that starts out fresh with you knowing everything that went into making that motor run the way it does and can give you the piece of mind that the motor should be good for 250k more miles.
Thanks guys, I had the car towed to a local shop for inspection, the head will have to be removed come Monday to check out what's going on.. he says it's probably going to need a new head, and we both agreed if it comes to that.. that a engine swap would be in best interest and cheapest (obviously).

I called Bavarian Auto Recycling today, they said they don't rebuild e46 engines, that there's no money in it.. they quoted me $2,200 for a tested engine at 88k.. that isn't including CA tax, or shipping.. I will be better off looking into damaged e46's, and eBay engines.. If anyone has any places they recommend for buying a used engine, please let me know.. I really need a working car, and this is probably going to be a project I undertake myself with the help of my best friend and fellow e46fanatic.. it's going to be a long road..

Thank you everyone for your support, as soon as I hear back and have more info on just what exactly happened to the car, I will post more information.

Thank you thank you thank you.

Stevo.
__________________

Thanks to all e46fanatics and other BMW forum users, without the community, our wallets would be more empty than they already are.
I do ECU Coding, contact me.
stevodotorg is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-20-2012, 06:38 PM   #53
Loaded325i
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: oregon
Posts: 250
My Ride: bmw 325i
This is probably due to oil problems. Another way this could happen is if the head warps starting at cylinder 6 and 1. It will cause the cam shaft to bow and destroy your bearings and cam lobes.

You could probably get by from just changing the cylinder head if you are knowledgeable with assembly, especially since its all aluminum.

Just for the future if you decide to tinker around with anything, removing various cam caps or bottom end caps can cause damage to the rest of the assembly, there is a specific order to remove and torque stuff.

I cant believe a used BMW engine is almost the same price of a printed and balanced 400hp 383 chevy stroker. lol. I hope I dont need an engine soon.
__________________
A mechanical hobbyist and car enthusiast
1971 Datsun 240z Devil Z red
1999 740il Titanium Silver
2004 BMW 325i CW,PP and Sports Package
1996 toyota avalon-263,000-Sold
2003 Lexus Is300-Sold
2000 Acura TL-Sold
2000 Accord 5 speed-Sold

Last edited by Loaded325i; 11-20-2012 at 06:39 PM.
Loaded325i is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Censor is ON





All times are GMT -5. The time now is 04:01 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
(c) 1999 - 2011 performanceIX Inc - privacy policy - terms of use