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Old 11-22-2012, 11:58 AM   #81
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I'd tell them fk off too.
So why didn't they fk off and find another better paying job elsewhere?
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Old 11-22-2012, 12:24 PM   #82
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Why did management fk up the company in the first place?
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Old 11-22-2012, 01:08 PM   #83
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Why did management fk up the company in the first place?
Nowhere does it say that a company must be run well, or a business to be successful. Management screwed up? Owners can fire them. Workers unhappy with anything? They have the right to leave and find employment elsewhere. I'm sorry, but everything the guy said about the company, him making 35K isn't worth it, blah blah blah is BS. If the pay was too low, he could leave. If the conditions suck, he can leave. Apparently, since he WAS working there for a while, that is the market rate for that job (probably too high) and he had nowhere else to go with his low skill level. I realize it's fun to blame management and owners, but in reality, the workers are not slaves...they are free to leave anytime they wish and can find another job...or can they?
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Old 11-22-2012, 01:14 PM   #84
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I sincerely hope that your bosses don't cut your pay and fvck you out of your retirement fund while giving themselves a $7.7 million pay raise.
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Old 11-22-2012, 01:22 PM   #85
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I sincerely hope that your bosses don't cut your pay and fvck you out of your retirement fund while giving themselves a $7.7 million pay raise.
While I haven't had my pay cut, I have had a few years of no raises because times were tough. My owners also didn't make promises they know they can't keep. Anyone with a brain in a union should understand that these promises made to them can't be kept. Sooner or later, they are going to lose it all. I have gotten many job offers in the hotel unions around the country and turned them all down. I refuse to work in a union, I refuse to work for any company that employs union labor, and I refuse to work for companies that provide me with excellent pay, but I have to oversee union labor.

Oh and I don't have a retirement fund. I am responsible enough (personal responsibility FTW) to not need some union program or government program to take money from me because they feel that I am too stupid to save on my own. I save, invest and contribute to my own retirement fund as I see fit. The money is in MY control and not any company. Maybe if pensions didn't exist, these problems wouldn't happen.
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Old 11-22-2012, 02:03 PM   #86
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Sure.

Can't give yourself a million dollar raise because you have to fund an employee benefit?

Just get rid of the benefit.

You russians have a strange view of the world. I'm glad I'll never be a part of it.
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Old 11-22-2012, 02:21 PM   #87
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"I'd rather draw unemployment."

But wait...he is doing what he thinks is best for his family.

To quote Xcelratr "You guys have seen his books?"
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Old 11-22-2012, 02:25 PM   #88
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Nowhere does it say that a company must be run well, or a business to be successful. Management screwed up? Owners can fire them. Workers unhappy with anything? They have the right to leave and find employment elsewhere. I'm sorry, but everything the guy said about the company, him making 35K isn't worth it, blah blah blah is BS. If the pay was too low, he could leave. If the conditions suck, he can leave. Apparently, since he WAS working there for a while, that is the market rate for that job (probably too high) and he had nowhere else to go with his low skill level. I realize it's fun to blame management and owners, but in reality, the workers are not slaves...they are free to leave anytime they wish and can find another job...or can they?
And workers are free to work under the labor contract that mgmt signed and not have to agree to invalidate that contract for "the good of the company." I realize its fun to blame unions, but in reality, the corporation is bound by the labor contracts they sign. The corporation is free to dissolve anytime they wish.
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Old 11-22-2012, 02:53 PM   #89
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Why did management fk up the company in the first place?
Maybe it has to do with the BS union agreements...........

---------------

With 18,500 workers, Hostess has 12 different unions including the BCTGM, which has about 5,600 members on the bread and snack item production lines, and the International Brotherhood of Teamsters, which represents about 7,500 route sales representatives, drivers and other employees.

Unlike some non-unionized rivals, the maker of Wonder Bread and Drake's cakes had to navigate more than 300 labor contracts, with terms that often strained efficiency and competitiveness, Hostess officials have said. In some extreme cases, contract provisions required different products to be delivered on different trucks even when headed to the same place.

Aside from those so-called onerous labor contracts, Hostess has grappled for some time with rising ingredient costs and a growing health consciousness that has made its sugary cakes less popular. It filed for bankruptcy in January, only three years after emerging from a prior bankruptcy.


http://news.yahoo.com/twinkies-baker...--finance.html
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Old 11-22-2012, 02:58 PM   #90
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Of course it's the union's fault. It had nothing to do with management that couldn't stay out of BK with nearly $3 BILLION in annual sales.
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Old 11-22-2012, 03:21 PM   #91
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Maybe it has to do with the BS union agreements...........
And those BS union agreements were signed by who........Hostess management.
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Old 11-22-2012, 03:29 PM   #92
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And those BS union agreements were signed by who........Hostess management.
You are absolutely correct, but unions...theoretically...have responsible management too. And should have enough foresight to see that these rules have a negative long term impact.

The union is only interested in preserving union jobs, to increase union dues, to increase union management bonuses. They are not interested in the long term health of the company or the union members.

But at the end of the day, it was Hostess management that signed the contract.
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Old 11-22-2012, 03:33 PM   #93
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And workers are free to work under the labor contract that mgmt signed and not have to agree to invalidate that contract for "the good of the company." I realize its fun to blame unions, but in reality, the corporation is bound by the labor contracts they sign. The corporation is free to dissolve anytime they wish.
I agree and have said so many times. Companies that employ unions and have signed employment contracts deserve to go under.
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Old 11-22-2012, 03:34 PM   #94
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And those BS union agreements were signed by who........Hostess management.
Not signing those contracts can be catastrophic to the company, as the unions hold them hostage. There is a reason many consider unions legalized racketeering.
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Old 11-22-2012, 03:48 PM   #95
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Not signing those contracts can be catastrophic to the company, as the unions hold them hostage. There is a reason many consider unions legalized racketeering.
And the US govt enables them with the NLRB.

That agency should be eliminated ? Isn't that what lawyers, lawsuits and Judges are for ?
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Old 11-22-2012, 07:28 PM   #96
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"i'd rather draw unemployment."

+1
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Had to turn off the TV... Fox was making more sense than anyone else.

The rest of the world must be laughing at us now. It is so bad slipping to third world status...
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Old 11-23-2012, 12:27 AM   #97
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You are absolutely correct, but unions...theoretically...have responsible management too. And should have enough foresight to see that these rules have a negative long term impact.

The union is only interested in preserving union jobs, to increase union dues, to increase union management bonuses. They are not interested in the long term health of the company or the union members.

But at the end of the day, it was Hostess management that signed the contract.
They shouldn't be interested in the long term health of the company. As for the long term health of their members..well, that is subjective. They have more members than just those employeed by (the now defunct) Hostess. Taking that pay decrease may not be in the long term interest of the majority of its members. (It might be, but, it might not. Either case is as likely true.)


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Not signing those contracts can be catastrophic to the company, as the unions hold them hostage. There is a reason many consider unions legalized racketeering.
There is also a reason why many need to brush up their comprehension of what racketeering actually means.
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Old 11-23-2012, 07:22 AM   #98
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They shouldn't be interested in the long term health of the company? Really? What planet are you from? A healthy company enables them to be able to bargain from a stronger position to obtain better wages and benefits down the road. If they cut off their nose to spite their face then they doom themselves along with the company. It's not that hard of a concept to comprehend.

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Old 11-23-2012, 09:39 AM   #99
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Why do republicans want to keep all their profits, but socialize their losses?
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Old 11-23-2012, 12:58 PM   #100
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Nowhere does it say that a company must be run well, or a business to be successful. Management screwed up? Owners can fire them. Workers unhappy with anything? They have the right to leave and find employment elsewhere. I'm sorry, but everything the guy said about the company, him making 35K isn't worth it, blah blah blah is BS. If the pay was too low, he could leave. If the conditions suck, he can leave. Apparently, since he WAS working there for a while, that is the market rate for that job (probably too high) and he had nowhere else to go with his low skill level. I realize it's fun to blame management and owners, but in reality, the workers are not slaves...they are free to leave anytime they wish and can find another job...or can they?
Nowhere does it say that employees have to accept being paid less, or can't draw unemployment.
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