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Old 11-20-2012, 03:10 PM   #41
MarcusLSB
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I don't doubt that Mert achieved these times.. you'd need to know his history to understand the lengths at which he would go to prove something to someone. His dyno is in a barn on some rural farm.. his car looks like its hobbled together with zip ties and duct tape... I've seen the pictures.. and the videos.. there are no drag strips in Turkey if I recall.. but Mert is like a mad scientist out to prove to the world he can build the fastest E46 m3... he attempted to do this with the E36 M3 and that's what got him in hot water when he started selling turbo kits to customers before he finished the R&D.
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Old 11-20-2012, 03:44 PM   #42
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Originally Posted by MarcusLSB View Post
I don't doubt that Mert achieved these times.. you'd need to know his history to understand the lengths at which he would go to prove something to someone. His dyno is in a barn on some rural farm.. his car looks like its hobbled together with zip ties and duct tape... I've seen the pictures.. and the videos.. there are no drag strips in Turkey if I recall.. but Mert is like a mad scientist out to prove to the world he can build the fastest E46 m3... he attempted to do this with the E36 M3 and that's what got him in hot water when he started selling turbo kits to customers before he finished the R&D.
I read that Mert did this in 4th gear. I'll assume this is the case. In 4th gear, 60mph is achieved at 3,600rpm on factory tires. Merts tires may be even taller which would make 60mph at 3,500rpm or less. Jake's M3 is running one of the fastest spooling small turbo's available (the 6766) with the HPF stage 2.5. As you can see from the dynos below, at 3,600rpm Jake is making 190rwhp. If he started with 190rwhp in 4th at 60mph it would take 10 more than 10 seconds to get to 130mph. Mert's M3 with those big turbos and without NOS is making far less than 190rwhp at 3,600rpm and you can't spray more than double the engine output using NOS or you will likely punch a hole in the piston. That likely leaves him with at most 300rwhp at the start which makes the 4.23 impossible unless his car was dropped from a plane. So something else must be up.




Last edited by HPF Chris; 11-20-2012 at 03:46 PM.
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Old 11-20-2012, 03:48 PM   #43
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Chris,

First of all, congradulations on your success, I see your kits are going worldwide. I see Baris' AKA Providence's M3 as well, it is rock solid and performs very good. He is a very polite man, standup, and he let me dyno his stage 3 and I loved your stage 3, even with the old turbo.

Regarding dyno, I dynoed 997 (say 1000 whp) dynamics, thats 1200-1250 whp dyno jet, more than 2 years ago.
Since than I changed almost each part So now it should make even more power.

The way you connect strap IRS cars on dyno dynamics damages the wishbones so we aborted dyno runs.

1 single run at 700-800 whp and the wishbones are gone.

I also sold my Dyno for that very reason.

Now regarding videos, I never ended or finished my setup. Never went out for a video shootage. All of my vids, taken during testing various changes.

You or I can buy 100 units of go pro or sony cameras. This is an easy transaction.

I can put 15 cams into M3.

However, making a M3 powerful yet putting all that power down to road is a different task. This is where we differ.

All of my times were taken on regular highway surfaces. Yours on prepped track surfaces.

I have came up with 5,40- 5,49 s as my first 60-130 trial in April 2010. 2 1/2 years ago.

5,07 back in september 2010, E46 M3 TT.

Meanwhile, made a 4,49 s with my E36 M3 TT, may 2011.

The 4,49 s time of my E36 M3 inspired me a lot.

Worked a lot and achieved 4,93 s 60-130 mph, summer 2011. E46 M3 TT.

Worked more and went down to 4,63 60-130 mph, september 2011. E46 M3 TT.

Worked even harder and went down to 4,23 s 60-130 mph, october 2011. E46 M3 TT.

I have a video, it shows the 4,23 s run as well.



Providence knows what goes on this side of the world and can tell you how real my M3s are.

As you can see, this has been a progressive period.

On the 4,23 s run we sprayed 125-150 shot. On S54 block I went as much as 300 shot, but spinned so much and aborted 300 shot.
Its amazing when the 300 shot kicks in.

Chris, wont tell you how we achieve the 4,23 s with the big turbos and etc. You will have to work around and find.

Just imagine your stage 2,5 cars go 5,4 s. There is a 500-600 whp difference between my M3 and your stage 2,5. So my 4,23 is normal

Providence AKA Baris knows my car and he knows how often we have tested the setups. We go to the same shop.....

THERE ARE MANY VARIABLES AND ALL NEED TO MATCH EACHOTHER PERFECTLY SO THAT THE 4,23 S TIME HAPPENS.

By denying my times you cant make me list the magic list. You need to find out.

I ve been testing different cylinder heads, different compression ratios, different turbos, different ring and pinions, different intake manifolds, different housings.....

Stopped by 4,23 as my newborn became my Priority. Best thing in my life.

Now as the baby grows, I have some more free time to work on M3s.


Chris, its not necessary to put massive tires.

As you cooperated with John Reed your times will improve, his a great man.

Meanwhile my 60-130 times will go sub 4 s. as I have some new strategies.

The sub 4s will come with zero nitrous.

Nitrous will be used to get sub 3,5 s runs.

What I can promise is to ask Providence to videotape my m3 where you ll see many details. Just let me go sub 4 and Baris and me will do some vids.

Chris, remember my times are on unprepared road surfaces.

On a VHT'ed track my M3 would do better.

I found ways of putting power better to the ground.
Twin 68 turbos make good power and they need to be put down.

With the new techniques, I was able to improve my old times, was not able to make full runs. But the setup if faster and has more traction than ever before.

Even DSS axles' slack increased after the latest improvements.

Your priority was selling kits, with good quality. You did it.
You need to build kits, design, advertise... you got so many things to do. And you are doing good.

My priority was a very good 60-130 time, I am about to get it. I focuss on just 60-130 times.....

Sub 4. s is coming very soon.
For me its a big challenge to go sub 3,5 s. I Pray to have a sub 3,5 s 60-130 mph on road surface and make our E46 M3s take one of the first raws on the 6speed list.

J.Reed is a top notch man, he will help you a lot. Without J.Reed you would stuck to 5s 60-130 times.
I ll follow you and if you go faster than I do, I will be proud of you.
(remember you need to go faster than me on road surface )

Last edited by Twin_Turbo_S54; 11-20-2012 at 03:55 PM.
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Old 11-20-2012, 03:55 PM   #44
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Chris,

J.Reed is a top notch man, he will help you a lot.
I ll follow you and if you go faster than I do, I will be proud of you.
(remember you need to go faster than me on road surface )
Thanks for the video. Sounds good Mert and congrats on your new child. Better video footage would give you a lot more believers... Our car just needs some more track time and spray. John Reed will definitely help and we're hoping to be in the low 8's this year at the drag strip. We shall see.

Chris.
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Old 11-20-2012, 04:02 PM   #45
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Thanks for the video. Sounds good Mert and congrats on your new child. Better video footage would give you a lot more believers... Our car just needs some more track time and spray. John Reed will definitely help and we're hoping to be in the low 8's this year at the drag strip. We shall see.

Chris.

Chris,

Keep up the good work, hope you'll brake into 8s.

Who knows, I may buy a drag transmission package from you
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Old 11-20-2012, 04:12 PM   #46
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I don't doubt that Mert achieved these times.. you'd need to know his history to understand the lengths at which he would go to prove something to someone. His dyno is in a barn on some rural farm.. his car looks like its hobbled together with zip ties and duct tape... I've seen the pictures.. and the videos.. there are no drag strips in Turkey if I recall.. but Mert is like a mad scientist out to prove to the world he can build the fastest E46 m3... he attempted to do this with the E36 M3 and that's what got him in hot water when he started selling turbo kits to customers before he finished the R&D.

Marcus,
Each sentence is 100 % correct.

I sold the dynamics as I was not using it as it was damaging wishbones.
Imagine 1 power run and the lower wishbones get bent.

I had to weld some U shaped parts to the floor or chasis of the m3 and hook at these U shaped parts. Could not find an area to weld U shaped metal hooks.

Chris,

I was able to spray 300 shot @ 3000-3200 rpm. These S54s love nitrous

I can tell you that I was afraid to spray at so low down, but it works.

I run on CDI ignition thats necessary and the timing needs to be set properly to spray 300 shot @ 3000 rpm.

You need to have ignition coils in good condition.

The spark plugs need to be chosen for n20, for 300 shot.

My setup was dry, as I was enriching via fuel injectors. Safer for me.

@ 2900 rpm we do enrich and keep on enriching as the 300 shot asked for lots of fuel...

The extra kick with 300 shot is not something I can describe. It just kicks..
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Old 11-20-2012, 04:15 PM   #47
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Marcus,
Each sentence is 100 % correct.

I sold the dynamics as I was not using it as it was damaging wishbones.
Imagine 1 power run and the lower wishbones get bent.

I had to weld some U shaped parts to the floor or chasis of the m3 and hook at these U shaped parts. Could not find an area to weld U shaped metal hooks.

Chris,

I was able to spray 300 shot @ 3000-3200 rpm. These S54s love nitrous

I can tell you that I was afraid to spray at so low down, but it works.

I run on CDI ignition thats necessary and the timing needs to be set properly to spray 300 shot @ 3000 rpm.

You need to have ignition coils in good condition.

The spark plugs need to be chosen for n20, for 300 shot.

My setup was dry, as I was enriching via fuel injectors. Safer for me.

@ 2900 rpm we do enrich and keep on enriching as the 300 shot asked for lots of fuel...

The extra kick with 300 shot is not something I can describe. It just kicks..
Thanks for sharing Mert!
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Old 11-20-2012, 04:16 PM   #48
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Awesome ride you have Mert!

Are you willing to share some photos of your build?

Think threads like this is very good for the e46 community..
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Old 11-20-2012, 04:18 PM   #49
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Awesome ride you have Mert!

Are you willing to share some photos of your build?

Think threads like this is very good for the e46 community..

If I wont get banned I ll post some pics

How is the weather over there? Snowy?
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Old 11-20-2012, 04:32 PM   #50
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That would be great! would love if everyone in here could share som info with each other, so that everyone ends up a bit faster in the end!
That is the purpose of forums in my opinion!

Was snowy a little while ago, but now it has started to rain! Not long before winter kicks in for good!
And in Istanbul?

Humble thanks
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Old 11-20-2012, 04:42 PM   #51
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I would be very interested to hear what the bottlenecks are that you have found over the past few years...if you would be willing to share.
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Old 11-20-2012, 04:53 PM   #52
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Chris,

this is a dyno run, from june 2011.



Engine was 3100 cc, I was testing SLEEVED S54B31.

@ 3600 rpm 153 whp dynamics = 180 whp dyno jet.

A: 1,016 means % 1,6 corrected. So the power was raised by dyno computer by 1,6 % due to raise in intake temps. Intake temps were 31 C.

this was a 3100 cc S54.

I cant find the 3,5L dyno data as of now, will try to find it. Need to find the file.

With the 3,5L engine it made, if I remember correctly, 195-210 whp dynamics. Thats 240 whp dyno jet.

Now add to 240 dyno jet whp 300 whp nitrous, and you will end up with 540 whp to start the 60-130 mph test.

As the nitrous wont add 300 whp only, sometimes it adds more than 300 whp as it helps build more and more boost, I can tell you that I start with at least 550 whp to run the 60-130 test.

Back in 2009, Neel from Apex Speed was amazed when he saw my M3 putting down 845 whp (1000 whp dyno jet) with 91 octane pump gas. those were made in shoot out mode. zero correction. 1000 whp 3,2Litres, 91 octane.

After he saw the 1000 whp dyno jet, he got off immediately, ringed USA and talked to some friends of him, he was excited. He tried to explain where he could not as he was shocked.
The gist of the story was we made over 2000 dyno runs before Neel arrived at our dyno

Neel and I sprayed nitrous with pump gas, he wanted to knock the engine to see the knock limits, we saw the..............................limits. 845 whp base power on pump gas did not allow for n20. Learnt the knock limits of S54, at the expense of....


Opps, this 3100 cc S54 made 779 whp (917 whp dyno jet) @ ONLY 6000 rpm.
With no nitrous. So at 6500 rpm we are over 1000 whp.....so on and on.

Imagine, it does rev to 9200 rpm....

Dont want to take your time, S54 and M3s are my passion.
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Old 11-20-2012, 05:02 PM   #53
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I must see this beast! Killer work Mert!

HPF dragster will do work next year
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Old 11-20-2012, 05:08 PM   #54
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I would be very interested to hear what the bottlenecks are that you have found over the past few years...if you would be willing to share.

Well, there are many bottlenecks.

I did test different exhaust manifolds, intake manifolds, fuel systems, this and that. Testing revealed different bottlenecks at various points.

"traction" is essential. RWD and traction dont always match.

If I were you, I would work on traction as your power is way more than enough to make some solid 60-130 times. I would solely focus on traction and wont spend money on power upgrades. Just my 2 cents.

After a certain point, the money you will spend wont turn back as improvements in performance. This is why I find HPF stage 2,5 a very good purposed kit.

Daily, lots of power to play with....

Just improve your traction.
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Old 11-20-2012, 05:30 PM   #55
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Did u figure out the problem with the powerbox or is it still problematic after the firmware update ?
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Old 11-20-2012, 05:34 PM   #56
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Did u figure out the problem with the powerbox or is it still problematic after the firmware update ?
Bro, it reads than seeks for satellite.

Even if it find the satellite, it does not write onto the card.

But it does display on the screen.....What to do
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Old 11-20-2012, 05:34 PM   #57
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how strong is the S54 block?

lets see some block x-ray shots




need to get more traction, a hint




my friend Cem, he is a top notch guy, trying to warm the tires...




E36 M3 S50 B32,
VERTICAL MOUNT & GT4788




Cutting bellhousing, rotating, rewelding to make it a VERTICAL S50 B32






my 1st M3, lovely individual color.





this is how the color looks. This is the 4,49 s running M3....




Me and the S54 engine bay with some direct port n20, one of the 68 mm turbos up top.




before a "test"




on the dyno, front fenders removed to avoid paint damage











Last edited by Twin_Turbo_S54; 11-20-2012 at 05:36 PM.
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Old 11-20-2012, 05:39 PM   #58
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Bro, it reads than seeks for satellite.

Even if it find the satellite, it does not write onto the card.

But it does display on the screen.....What to do
Did u do another cold start ? We can flash it again I guess
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Old 11-20-2012, 05:39 PM   #59
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Originally Posted by Twin_Turbo_S54 View Post
Well, there are many bottlenecks.

I did test different exhaust manifolds, intake manifolds, fuel systems, this and that. Testing revealed different bottlenecks at various points.

"traction" is essential. RWD and traction dont always match.

If I were you, I would work on traction as your power is way more than enough to make some solid 60-130 times. I would solely focus on traction and wont spend money on power upgrades. Just my 2 cents.

After a certain point, the money you will spend wont turn back as improvements in performance. This is why I find HPF stage 2,5 a very good purposed kit.

Daily, lots of power to play with....

Just improve your traction.
I am looking at quicker spool, smaller turbo with a more efficient design...my goal is efficiency.
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Old 11-20-2012, 05:43 PM   #60
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Did u do another cold start ? We can flash it again I guess
I cold start, sometimed the cold start ends up with ERROR message.

Sometimed it completes COLD START.

Thursday, lets meet for lunch.

Quote:
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I am looking at quicker spool, smaller turbo with a more efficient design...my goal is efficiency.
that sounds wise.

A compound set up maybe? Compound charging....
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