If turbos give better fuel economy why don't all econobox have them

Originally Posted by E46330iguy

Because It wouldnt save you fuel on a 40 hp Engine, A turbo atomizes the air to help it burn better. Larger engines tend to be less efficent thus why they make a difference is my understanding

WTF is "atomizing" air?

Turbos are spun by exhaust gases and compress intake air for more air per unit of volume, which leads to more combustion and resulting in more power.

It does nothing to the displacement of the engine as mentioned, unless that person meant it effectively increases power to that of a larger displacement engine.

Wow, guys...

Not all "econoboxes" have them because while you could strap a turbo to almost anything, to make it last and perform reliably, you'd have to reinforce a lot of components which costs more. Also, there is no point in turbo charging an econobox if the target demo is looking for an econobox and not a sports car.

To get at your point, there are econoboxes that get turbo'd: lancer-->lancer evolution; dodge whatever-->a little faster dodge whatever, etc.

Watching history unfold.

A turbo: Exhaust gasses go into the turbocharger and spin it, witchcraft happens, and you go faster.

Originally Posted by alphawhiskey

WTF is "atomizing" air?

Turbos are spun by exhaust gases and compress intake air for more air per unit of volume, which leads to more combustion and resulting in more power.

It does nothing to the displacement of the engine as mentioned, unless that person meant it effectively increases power to that of a larger displacement engine.

Wow, guys...

This.

Originally Posted by mkodama

Economy cars are meant to be economical to buy and run. If you want the best fuel economy, spend more money for a hybrid or electric car.

Turbos also don't give you better fuel economy. They just push more air into the engine.




That is possibly one of the dumbest things I've read on E46Fanatics in a while.

False. It is this administrations (Bush too) moronic push for clean energy (which is actually filthy) that kept diesels off our shores as mainstream vehicles. Diesels have been getting 50+ MPG since the 80s, and the current crop of econo diesels are breaking the 75mpg mark.

http://www.whatgas.com/fuel/diesel-mpg.html

They are also CHEAPER. Diesel in the US is expensive, and cars like TDI Audis cost MORE than their gas counterparts....in Europe, the diesel models are not only more economical, but they cost less....and are more reliable. A diesel motor for the average driver is a godsend, since they suffer less mechanical problems and can run to 100-200K without much sweat.

Because of the cost involved in producing a small and efficient turbo engine (Forged internals, The turbos themselves, More robust exhaust and intake...).
At the end of the day you will end up with a more powerful engine but the fuel economy wont be that great compared to a small N/A engine, it will also be more expensive to maintain for the manufacturer (warranty) which increases the price, premium fuel is a must in order to avoid detonation which becomes more expensive to run... In Diesel applications it is understandable because of the lack of power on small diesel N/A engines.

Originally Posted by simsima325

In before everyone is an engineer all of a sudden.

I'm an engineer...but engineers don't tend to speak on a subject unless they truly understand it and can present the material logically.

Originally Posted by wceoscar

Because of the cost involved in producing a small and efficent turbo engine (Forged internals, The turbos themselves, More robust exhaust and intake...).
And at the end of the day you will end up with a more powerful engine but the fuel economy wont be that great compared to a small N/A engine.

Unfortunately, many turbo cars are not using fully forged internals. Lots of cast pistons still being used in turbo applications for emissions reasons.

Originally Posted by wceoscar

Because of the cost involved in producing a small and efficent turbo engine (Forged internals, The turbos themselves, More robust exhaust and intake...).
And at the end of the day you will end up with a more powerful engine but the fuel economy wont be that great compared to a small N/A engine.

You don't need forged internals for a low pressure low HP turbo application.

Originally Posted by b0bab0i

And there's beeen alot of dumb things said on E46Fanatics.

Originally Posted by SamDoe1

Yes, but the small engine allows you to get better fuel economy when the turbo is not feeding boost and provides power, even with a small engine, when feeding boost. Best of both worlds.

I agree, but OP didn't mention a smaller engine.

Originally Posted by bimmerfan08

I'm an engineer...but engineers don't tend to speak on a subject unless they truly understand it and can present the material logically.

Unless that subject happens to be gun control, apparently.









I keed! I keed!

Originally Posted by NFRs2000nyc

False. It is this administrations (Bush too) moronic push for clean energy (which is actually filthy) that kept diesels off our shores as mainstream vehicles. Diesels have been getting 50+ MPG since the 80s, and the current crop of econo diesels are breaking the 75mpg mark.

http://www.whatgas.com/fuel/diesel-mpg.html

They are also CHEAPER. Diesel in the US is expensive, and cars like TDI Audis cost MORE than their gas counterparts....in Europe, the diesel models are not only more economical, but they cost less....and are more reliable. A diesel motor for the average driver is a godsend, since they suffer less mechanical problems and can run to 100-200K without much sweat.

Umm, what's false? I should have included diesels, but that doesn't make anything false.

Your statements about diesel costs are incorrect though. Diesel engines don't make as much power as similar sized gasoline engines, so they need to compensate for that, as well as they need stronger (more expensive) components to deal with increased cylinder pressures, and lastly clean diesel injection and exhaust treatment systems are very new and very expensive.

Going from zero to politics in 30 posts or less, lol.

Originally Posted by simsima325

In before everyone is an engineer all of a sudden.

Originally Posted by VaderDave

Unless that subject happens to be gun control, apparently.









I keed! I keed!

I have no idea of what you are talking about.

I'll let the SMEs handle this topic.

I think people's main understanding of turbos is that they force air into the engine. That is cool except that doing only that results in a very lean mixture. Those kids who slap a chinese turbo onto their rusty DSM and blow it up learn this the hard way.

Manufactures have to increase the fuel as well as the air input into an engine. The only "Economy" you get from turbos is when they are in the phase of very low to no boost and the fuel system doesn't increase the mixture. When you are in boost, you are shoving extra fuel into the combustion chamber as well.

To the guy who thinks a turbo atomizes air, I don't want to be on this planet anymore.

Originally Posted by SPDSKTR

My favorite cars with turbos are the ones with lackbof turbos.

concur.

Originally Posted by E46330iguy

A turbo atomizes the air to help it burn better.

true story... the blades chop up the air until they're small as atoms.

Originally Posted by broey v

true story... the blades chop up the air until they're small as atoms.

Chapter 1, page 2, of the petrosexual handbook.

Originally Posted by mkodama

Economy cars are meant to be economical to buy and run. If you want the best fuel economy, spend more money for a hybrid or electric car.

Turbos also don't give you better fuel economy. They just push more air into the engine.




That is possibly one of the dumbest things I've read on E46Fanatics in a while.

even dumber than when he said he trailers his 330 1000's of miles to go autox'ing.

Who cares