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Old 03-27-2012, 09:21 AM   #1
curt2199
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Brake shake and already replace rotors....

It feels just like a warped rotor but I just put brand new rotors on it and it's still doing it. If I stop slowly, I don't get any shake but if I stop moderately to quickly, it does the grab and go feeling. I also noticed when I had the car jacked up and spun the wheel, there was a slight wobble to it like maybe (1/16-1/8""). I don't seem to get any steering wheel shake or movement though. And I get a vibration in third gear as well, but only third gear (may be un-related, but also want to fix it). I have 90k miles on it.

So far I'm thinking either a bent wheel or hub? I'm going to pull the wheel off again and try to spin the hub and see if I noticed a wobble in it.

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Old 03-27-2012, 10:42 AM   #2
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What did I tell you guys about "warped" rotors?

OP, if it vibrates only while braking, don't bother checking wheels/hubs/etc. Your control arm bushings or associated balljoints (whole control arms) are shot.
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Old 03-27-2012, 10:51 AM   #3
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Rotors were due to be replaced anyway so no regrets there.

Also, I'm getting like a shh, shh, shh sound from the driver's side wheel well while rolling at low speeds. I expected to have a plastic bag or some debris or something stuck up in there but it was clean and after checking out youtube for some videos of the sound I'm hearing I found an exact video of the sound. Not saying the control arm bushings may not be worn but I'd rather not have to pull the control arms out if I don't have to yet.


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Old 03-27-2012, 11:14 AM   #4
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Thats normal for any car. My car does that too so has every other car i've encountered. my brakes are as solid and smooth as glass. no vibration whatsoever. you just put new rotors/pads anwyay so its not that. trust me, it's your control arm bushings. when'd you last replace them?
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Old 03-27-2012, 11:17 AM   #5
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As far as I know the control arm bushings have never been replaced as I haven't replaced them since I got the car at 70k and I doubt they go out before then. And you car and every car you've encountered makes that rythmic noise every time the wheel turns? This is the first car I've ever had that made a rythmic brushing noise every time the wheel turns and it hasn't been there the whole time I've had the car.
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Old 03-27-2012, 11:25 AM   #6
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Why would you doubt they go out before then? They actually go out around 50k miles. It's not an on-off switch, it's a gradual degradation. Trust me, they're popped. Replace them.

You have new pads/rotors. It's not that.
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Old 03-27-2012, 11:26 AM   #7
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He replaced only the rotors not pads.. you should of done the pads also.
Are your tires bald or just crappy?

Check your joints, lift the front and grab the wheel at 9 and 3o'click positions and push/pull wiggle it. Make sure your steering wheel is locked so that you cant turn the wheel left/right.
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Old 03-27-2012, 11:28 AM   #8
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He replaced only the rotors not pads.. you should of done the pads also.
Are your tires bald or just crappy?

Check your joints, lift the front and grab the wheel at 9 and 3o'click positions and push/pull wiggle it. Make sure your steering wheel is locked so that you cant turn the wheel left/right.
95% of the time, shaking the wheel with your hands won't reveal worn control arm bushings unless the rubbers totally busted--in which case you wouldn't need to lift the car and shake the tire/wheel to find that out. It would be painfully obvious as you brake and you hear a metal-to-metal clunk.
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Old 03-27-2012, 12:40 PM   #9
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Pads are like brand new still, they were replaced in the last 15k miles. Tires have about 50% tread... continental contiprocontact ssr.

Will do the wiggle check tonight.

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Originally Posted by jeepo23 View Post
He replaced only the rotors not pads.. you should of done the pads also.
Are your tires bald or just crappy?

Check your joints, lift the front and grab the wheel at 9 and 3o'click positions and push/pull wiggle it. Make sure your steering wheel is locked so that you cant turn the wheel left/right.
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Old 03-27-2012, 12:45 PM   #10
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At 50k? I'd expect that from a chrysler or something using inferior parts/materials or a bad design but yeah 50k seems early for control arms unless I'm racing it everywhere, which I don't drive that way and I don't think the previous owner did as had full service records when I bought it and was in excellent shape all around (can't find the paperwork now). I'll check them out though, just don't want to go replacing more things that don't fix the problem. Everyone on here told me I had a bad spot in my starter and I spent $150 on a starter and spent about 3 hours painstakingly putting it in to find out then that it was actually the ignition switch that was bad. That took 5 mins.

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Why would you doubt they go out before then? They actually go out around 50k miles. It's not an on-off switch, it's a gradual degradation. Trust me, they're popped. Replace them.

You have new pads/rotors. It's not that.
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Old 03-27-2012, 01:22 PM   #11
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At 50k? I'd expect that from a chrysler or something using inferior parts/materials or a bad design but yeah 50k seems early for control arms unless I'm racing it everywhere, which I don't drive that way and I don't think the previous owner did as had full service records when I bought it and was in excellent shape all around (can't find the paperwork now). I'll check them out though, just don't want to go replacing more things that don't fix the problem. Everyone on here told me I had a bad spot in my starter and I spent $150 on a starter and spent about 3 hours painstakingly putting it in to find out then that it was actually the ignition switch that was bad. That took 5 mins.
I said control arm bushings, not control arms. Sounds like you havent been in the BMW community for very long. You'll learn. Parts made to perform can have a tendency to fail "early" and require replacement
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Old 09-26-2012, 05:54 PM   #12
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I have the whirring wheel noise when turning and also vibration when semi braking heavily. The steering wheel doesn't shake. I have replaced the front lower control arm bushings and replaced pads and rotors all the way

Could it need new control arms?
(Ball joints in the middle shot)

Or perhaps trailing arm bushings?
The back end doesn't feel loose at all tho.
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Old 09-26-2012, 05:56 PM   #13
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^likely control arms or tierods
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Old 09-27-2012, 09:50 AM   #14
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Have very similar symptoms and I'm replacing my CA and FCAB's this weekend.
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Old 09-27-2012, 09:57 AM   #15
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Your bushings and control arms are definitely shot. 70K on OEM FCABS and FCA is a lot. Get some Meyle HD parts. I put powerflex bushings in, and they are fine, but Mango doesn't like them. If the RTABs haven't been replaced you should do them also. OEM with limiters works, I put in powerflex on the rear also (much stiffer). I should note that I bought my car with 65k miles and all my bushings were shot and the steering guibo is shot (still need to replace it). After replacing and getting a toe alignment it drives great minus the steering play from the guibo. Does your car tramline heavily?

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Old 09-27-2012, 10:26 AM   #16
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Your bushings and control arms are definitely shot. 70K on OEM FCABS and FCA is a lot. Get some Meyle HD parts. I put powerflex bushings in, and they are fine, but Mango doesn't like them. If the RTABs haven't been replaced you should do them also. OEM with limiters works, I put in powerflex on the rear also (much stiffer). I should note that I bought my car with 65k miles and all my bushings were shot and the steering guibo is shot (still need to replace it). After replacing and getting a toe alignment it drives great minus the steering play from the guibo. Does your car tramline heavily?
I never tried them so I didn't mean I don't like them personally. I don't like the concept. You might more easily notice your FCABs should they become shot versus the poly RTABs. Lots of people (3/4th of this forum I guarantee you) drive around with blown RTABs and not even know it. They attribute their car's sloppy rear to just "being an old car." Some of you with 100k miles or more on unknown or original RTABs might want to look into it. In fact, according to Vorshlag, your stock RTABs are blown after just 20k miles (and that's the heavier M3 RTABs! imagine your non-M ones! Peak into your trailing arm brackets and if you see areas where dirt or paint is rubbed off, it means theres too much play in the bushing. If it gets really bad (no rtab) you might hear the actual arm banging around inside the pocket.

Taken from Vorshlag:

Many racers just blindly install polyurethane into this and all bushing locations as a "fix" for a worn OEM rubber RTAB bushing. Polyurethane is a bad choice for a bushing material if it has to deflect - such as in a multi-axis suspension bushing location like the RTAB. Rubber bushings + limiters or a complete replacement with a custom steel spherical bearing are the only two textbook choices for this location. We cannot count the number of times we have seen RTAB or front LCA failures on BMWs that were using poly in these areas - an expensive repair and dangerous racing situation. At the very least poly will add bind during significant suspension movement, and this can make the handling feel odd (unexplained oversteer) as well as add significant stress to the suspension-to-chassis mounts (which is how they can fail over time).

That said, some folks with fully track prepared race BMWs have had OK results with polyurethane RTABs. This is due to the much higher spring rates and smoothness of tracks they tend to run with - higher spring rates and smooth tracks limit suspension travel, and thus limits the potential for bind from a polyurethane bushing at this bushing location. So even though you may hear good results from one racer, it doesn't necessarily mean that poly RTABs are the right choice for you. If you have a street car or dual purpose BMW you should always stick with OEM bushings and RTAB limiters, and even many race prepped BMWs use this setup with excellent results.
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Old 09-27-2012, 10:38 AM   #17
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http://www.bmaparts.com/item.wws?sku...D&weight=17.69

OP, get these. They come with the bushings pre-pressed on the control arms and the control arms themselves have replaceable ball joints so you don't have to buy the entire control arm next time your ball joints go out.
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Old 09-27-2012, 11:27 AM   #18
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http://www.bmaparts.com/item.wws?sku...D&weight=17.69

OP, get these. They come with the bushings pre-pressed on the control arms and the control arms themselves have replaceable ball joints so you don't have to buy the entire control arm next time your ball joints go out.
Same set that I just got myself. I got free shipping and they made it to my house in 2 days.
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Old 09-27-2012, 11:28 AM   #19
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^ Make sure you use Genuine BMW nuts for the control arm as recommended in my suspension thread. Do not use the Meyle-supplied nuts.
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Old 09-27-2012, 11:32 AM   #20
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^ Make sure you use Genuine BMW nuts for the control arm as recommended in my suspension thread. Do not use the Meyle-supplied nuts.
Want to give me a quick run down as to why? Also, where to purchase said nuts?
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