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Old 01-08-2013, 03:39 PM   #61
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Rotella doesn't show an ACEA spec of A3/B3. I have a bottle in the garage and just checked...use it in the Subaru. I checked Shell's website when I got it for my son's car and decided that 'no ACEA A3/B3' that it's not going in my car.

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Old 01-08-2013, 03:43 PM   #62
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Rotella doesn't show an ACEA spec of A3/B3. I have a bottle in the garage and just checked...use it in the Subaru. I checked Shell's website when I got it for my son's car and decided that 'no ACEA A3/B3' that it's not going in my car.

Agip 5/40 for me next I think...LL-01
Good choice.
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Old 01-08-2013, 03:45 PM   #63
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Wrong. A 5W30 ranges from near 20W to near 40W, that isn't 'close enough' is it? LL01 oil is near 40W, has a HTHS of at least 3.5 etc etc. It's always hard discussing oil, with people who know SFA about oil.
Yeah it is "close enough". There is a fairly wide gap b/w the bottom of an SAE 30 and the top of an SAE 30, but the group only has certain increments for a reason. They could make ratings like SAE 32 or hell SAE 36.87 if they wanted, but it's not really necessary. As for other characteristics, who says something like Castrol Syntex doesn't meet that high temp/high shear rating? I'd be willing to bet most modern synthetics are pretty damn similar, but whatever. The car is going to run fine on almost any oil of 5W-30, especially with regular service intervals.

Would you stop thinking you are the master of oil around here? I don't **** on other people's knowledge going YOU DON'T KNOW ANYTHING ABOUT MECHANICAL DESIGN just because I'm an engineer. All you ever do is make unsubstantiated claims about oil IN EVERY OIL THREAD or anything that has to do with oil. Unless you are a chemical engineer, then you don't know **** about oil either. Don't get me going on the BITOG community either. Bunch of speculating morons trying to make sense of UOA chemistry they have no idea about.

Does anyone even have a sheet of the LL-01 specification. As in, what characteristics does the oil have to have? I can't find anything except some random forum posts mentioning HTHS of 3.5. For all I know that could be bullshit. Is there anything BMW official?

Last edited by WDE46; 01-08-2013 at 03:51 PM.
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Old 01-08-2013, 03:51 PM   #64
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Yeah it is "close enough". There is a fairly wide gap b/w the bottom of an SAE 30 and the top of an SAE 30, but the group only has certain increments for a reason. They could make ratings like SAE 32 or hell SAE 36.87 if they wanted, but it's not really necessary. As for other characteristics, who says something like Castrol Syntex doesn't meet that high temp/high shear rating? I'd be willing to bet most modern synthetics are pretty damn similar, but whatever. The car is going to run fine on almost any oil of 5W-30, especially with regular service intervals.

Would you stop thinking you are the master of oil around here? I don't **** on other people's knowledge going YOU DON'T KNOW ANYTHING ABOUT MECHANICAL DESIGN just because I'm an engineer. All you ever do is make unsubstantiated claims about oil IN EVERY OIL THREAD or anything that has to do with oil. Unless you are a chemical engineer, then you don't know **** about oil either. Don't get me going on the BITOG community either. Bunch of speculating morons trying to make sense of UOA chemistry they have no idea about.
Castrols own specs show Syntex has a low HTHS. That takes care of that nonsense. And I sure know more about oil than you do. You're an embarrassment if you really are an an engineer, but I suspect not. Go and do some study and come back when you can respond intelligently.

Last edited by sprintman; 01-08-2013 at 03:51 PM.
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Old 01-08-2013, 04:04 PM   #65
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Rotella doesn't show an ACEA spec of A3/B3. I have a bottle in the garage and just checked...use it in the Subaru. I checked Shell's website when I got it for my son's car and decided that 'no ACEA A3/B3' that it's not going in my car.

Agip 5/40 for me next I think...LL-01
The lack of A3/B3 spec could be because it is a diesel oil, and diesel oils have different specifications. It shows an ACEA E9 rating, as well as an MB 228.31 approval.

I just wonder if this oil has A3/B3 equivalents as far as the actual numbers concerned. The viscosity specs I found for the T6 (in the bf.c thread posted earlier) are quite good, i.e. some 14.2 cST at operating temp, better than any LL-01 oil that I'm aware of.

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Old 01-08-2013, 04:06 PM   #66
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The lack of A3/B3 spec could be because it is a diesel oil, and diesel oils have different specifications. It shows an ACEA E9 rating, as well as an MB 228.31 approval.

I just wonder if this oil has A3/B3 equivalents as far as the actual numbers concerned. The viscosity specs I found for the T6 (in the bf.c thread posted earlier) are quite good, i.e. some 14.2 cST at operating temp.

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Old 01-08-2013, 04:17 PM   #67
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Mango, my dear. We meet again. Just wanted to share the oil I've been using for all the BMW's I've owned. You said my Penzoil 5-30 wasn't up to spec in the other thread.

http://pennzoil.com/motor-oil/pennzo...Specifications
Pennzoil PlatinumŽ Euro Ultra 5W-30 meets API SH/CF, ACEA A3/B4, MB-Approval 229.5, BMW LL-01, and VW 502 00/505 00/503.01

Check again, brother, under specs. Just about $8/qt and I stand by it.
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Old 01-08-2013, 04:21 PM   #68
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Mango, my dear. We meet again. Just wanted to share the oil I've been using for all the BMW's I've owned. You said my Penzoil 5-30 wasn't up to spec in the other thread.

http://pennzoil.com/motor-oil/pennzo...Specifications
Pennzoil PlatinumŽ Euro Ultra 5W-30 meets API SH/CF, ACEA A3/B4, MB-Approval 229.5, BMW LL-01, and VW 502 00/505 00/503.01

Check again, brother, under specs. Just about $8/qt and I stand by it.
That is Pennzoil Platinum 5w-30. Regular Pennzoil 5w-30 doesn't meet the specs.

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Old 01-08-2013, 04:39 PM   #69
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That is Pennzoil Platinum 5w-30. Regular Pennzoil 5w-30 doesn't meet the specs.

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Old 01-08-2013, 05:24 PM   #70
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Castrols own specs show Syntex has a low HTHS. That takes care of that nonsense. And I sure know more about oil than you do. You're an embarrassment if you really are an an engineer, but I suspect not. Go and do some study and come back when you can respond intelligently.
Okay that's fine but where are these specs? Where is the BMW LL-01 specification of HTHS > 3.5? I've just never seen it and I'm very curious.

Anyway I just hate your attitude. You don't know what I know, and I don't know what you know. I am a mechanical engineer, not chemical, though I did study some lubrication. I didn't find it interesting. Your attitude is that you know more than anybody here about oil. You just can't know that. It would help to explain things as well. If you think I'm dead wrong, then educate me please. Provide us with some of your resources and it'll help everyone.
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Old 01-08-2013, 05:36 PM   #71
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Okay that's fine but where are these specs? Where is the BMW LL-01 specification of HTHS > 3.5? I've just never seen it and I'm very curious.

Anyway I just hate your attitude. You don't know what I know, and I don't know what you know. I am a mechanical engineer, not chemical, though I did study some lubrication. I didn't find it interesting. Your attitude is that you know more than anybody here about oil. You just can't know that. It would help to explain things as well. If you think I'm dead wrong, then educate me please. Provide us with some of your resources and it'll help everyone.
Not once have I said or opined that I know more about oil than anybody. That's your slant on reading what you don't understand, but I'm fine with that. As for LL01 specs it's easy to find. The non U.S owners manual spells it out in black and white, even to the point that ACEA A3, B3 oil is OK for a while. BMWNA in their wisdom decided to delete all the relevant information, as it would confuse Americans. So the 5W30 CAFE spec oil in the U.S owners manual is BMW 5W30, specifically made by Castrol to LL01 specs for BMWNA. They didn't expect U.S owners to extrapolate that out to mean "use any 5W30" but that's what happened, so much so that even some U.S stealerships use non spec 5W30 such as Mobil 1. BMWNA have a lot to answer for.

Last edited by sprintman; 01-08-2013 at 05:37 PM.
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Old 01-08-2013, 05:51 PM   #72
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I stopped reading Sprintman and his oil opinions here years ago...once I understood there were rules that he's written about maybe 10,000 times now, I didn't need to read him again.

M1 5w/30 users...search my thread on this...one of my early ones...and one of the reasons why I now hate oil threads like everyone else!

You can trust Sprintman on oil...and me too...use LL-01 or acea a3/b3 it's not that complicated...though it can be if you get into it.
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Old 01-08-2013, 05:52 PM   #73
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I stopped reading Sprintman and his oil opinions here years ago...once I understood there were rules that he's written about maybe 10,000 times now, I didn't need to read him again.

M1 5w/30 users...search my thread on this...one of my early ones...and one of the reasons why I now hate oil threads like everyone else!

You can trust Sprintman on oil...and me too...use LL-01 or acea a3/b3 it's not that complicated...though it can be if you get into it.
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Old 01-08-2013, 08:39 PM   #74
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Not once have I said or opined that I know more about oil than anybody. That's your slant on reading what you don't understand, but I'm fine with that. As for LL01 specs it's easy to find. The non U.S owners manual spells it out in black and white, even to the point that ACEA A3, B3 oil is OK for a while. BMWNA in their wisdom decided to delete all the relevant information, as it would confuse Americans. So the 5W30 CAFE spec oil in the U.S owners manual is BMW 5W30, specifically made by Castrol to LL01 specs for BMWNA. They didn't expect U.S owners to extrapolate that out to mean "use any 5W30" but that's what happened, so much so that even some U.S stealerships use non spec 5W30 such as Mobil 1. BMWNA have a lot to answer for.
Anyone have a copy of the BMW euro manual? I still want to know what exactly LL-01 means in terms of the oil's critical properties. Is that in there, or just equivalent specs?

I'll look for a bit.
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Old 01-08-2013, 09:16 PM   #75
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Try this: Mobil 1 EF 0W40 spec sheet.

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Old 01-08-2013, 09:27 PM   #76
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Try this: Mobil 1 EF 0W40 spec sheet.
+1, its what I use.
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Old 01-08-2013, 11:03 PM   #77
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+1, its what I use.
Dealer oil here was M1 0W40, and every independent shop I know still use it. Stealership oil is now Castrol LL01 0W40 but i'll check.
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Old 01-09-2013, 01:38 AM   #78
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Mango, my dear. We meet again. Just wanted to share the oil I've been using for all the BMW's I've owned. You said my Penzoil 5-30 wasn't up to spec in the other thread.

http://pennzoil.com/motor-oil/pennzo...Specifications
Pennzoil PlatinumŽ Euro Ultra 5W-30 meets API SH/CF, ACEA A3/B4, MB-Approval 229.5, BMW LL-01, and VW 502 00/505 00/503.01

Check again, brother, under specs. Just about $8/qt and I stand by it.
Nice ninja edit. I've been promoting Pennzoil Euro for years. It's even in my thread.

You were and are using the wrong american pennzoil, IIRC from that thread a while back. Looks like SeanC beat me to it.

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Old 01-09-2013, 01:40 AM   #79
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http://www.bmwusa.com/Standard/Conte...eticEngineOils.

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Old 01-09-2013, 06:07 AM   #80
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Try this: Mobil 1 EF 0W40 spec sheet.
Excellent. This is what I was looking for, but I still want the LL-01 spec sheet. Does that even exist?

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link doesn't work
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