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Old 01-11-2013, 06:35 PM   #81
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I have a 323i, my dummy gauge is stays exactly at 12 oclock when warmed up and I hit 100 once fully warmed up at steady speed on freeway. Whenever I accelerate it drops to around 96. I looked in the bentley manual and it says Coolant temperature working value K -bus 100C (212F). This is exactly what mine runs at.
spdracr137,

What was your outside temp approximately when you run at 100C?
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Old 01-11-2013, 06:38 PM   #82
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And, as I was driving at 40 mph in 40 degree F temps in the rain...it read 90.

I think rain would aid a bit in the cooling efficiency of the radiator, but I'm just guessing.
DMAX, you may be getting a bit soft!

Suggest you keep an eye on things.

You may just be on the lower edge.

Assume you can wait it out for a while, I might put a stat on your Sept-Oct calendar?
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Old 01-11-2013, 06:41 PM   #83
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Upon just letting car sit there and warm up:

Ambient temps: 37-42 F

Hit 113 F then tapped gas, dropped to 88 in 5 seconds, then I drove away.
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Old 01-11-2013, 06:53 PM   #84
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DMAX, you may be getting a bit soft!

Suggest you keep an eye on things.

You may just be on the lower edge.

Assume you can wait it out for a while, I might put a stat on your Sept-Oct calendar?
Thank you, jfoj. That stat is an OE wahler put in a year or two ago at most. I run in perfectly normal zones...the 90 is easily attributable to the cold and rain imho...and it was only a short section of road. As I said, I was at 80 C on the highway after I noticed I was in third...but I'd been there a long time...the car was running just at the lower end of normal. It thought I was racing, and it was right!

Anyway, I probably do the cluster test once a month or so.

Sept-Oct. calendar? LOL jfoj, do you have a calendar of future bmw repairs? That's probably a great thing to do, but requires paperwork, which I'm incapable of doing.
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Old 01-11-2013, 08:22 PM   #85
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spdracr137,

What was your outside temp approximately when you run at 100C?
during the day outside temps have been around high 60 to 70F and when I drive home at night after work it's been in the 50s.
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Old 01-11-2013, 08:34 PM   #86
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during the day outside temps have been around high 60 to 70F and when I drive home at night after work it's been in the 50s.
Something is up with your cooling system. Could be 6 year old coolant, therm, belts, filthy condenser, years of plain water build up.

You may be able to fix this with just therm...depending on your mileage and what else you've done, you might want to do a bit more.
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Old 01-11-2013, 08:59 PM   #87
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Sept-Oct. calendar? LOL jfoj, do you have a calendar of future bmw repairs? That's probably a great thing to do, but requires paperwork, which I'm incapable of doing.
No, I just know what it is like to replace a themostat outside in mid Jan, coolant on your hands, dropping things in the lower engine cover black hole, cursing the entire time you did not catch the problem before weather turned to crap!

Quote:
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during the day outside temps have been around high 60 to 70F and when I drive home at night after work it's been in the 50s.
Thanks for the data points.

Unfortunately or fortunately depending on how you look at it, I do not drive the E46 regularly, its my wife's, I drive the M5 more often. So my summer time data points at this time are for my M5.

What I find with my M5 is right around outside temps in the upper 60F to just about 70F my temps start to climb above the baseline thermostat operating point. I cannot recall for sure, however, I believe in my M5 the coolant temp has never gone beyond 17C or 30F above the baseline thermostat operating temperature and this was with an outside temp of 106F!

So not sure you can expand this out with the E46 due to the electrically controlled thermostat element. If I tried to apply this same rule to the E46, the upper coolant temp would be approximately 235/113C which would be really high. BUT 113C is supposedly where the E46 buffered temp gauge starts to move beyond the 12 o'clock position so this MAY be the upper operating limit of the E46?? Also with the electrically controlled thermostat, the DME may be able to offset the upper threshold a bit.

Something to think about and try to get a baseline during the upcoming Summer temps.
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Old 01-11-2013, 09:00 PM   #88
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No, I just know what it is like to replace a themostat outside in mid Jan, coolant on your hands, dropping things in the lower engine cover black hole, cursing the entire time you did not catch the problem before weather turned to crap!
Just changed out the t- stat this afternoon. 2004 (late) 325xi. For about the last year, it'd throw a code for 'thermostat too cold' intermittently. Sometimes it'd turn the ses light, sometimes it wouldn't, often the light would go out after a day or 2.
Wasn't a problem this summer, but just recently, it wouldn't let the gauge go much above the blue- well below the
first mark. Interestingly, no ses light, haven't looked at codes yet.
So I pulled the old one- stuck wide open in 32f. weather.
Now it's back to 12:00. So, as for your hypothesis of 'usually sticks open', here's one positive data point.

fwiw

t

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Old 01-11-2013, 09:03 PM   #89
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Something is up with your cooling system. Could be 6 year old coolant, therm, belts, filthy condenser, years of plain water build up.

You may be able to fix this with just therm...depending on your mileage and what else you've done, you might want to do a bit more.
Actually if you see my earlier post you'll see that I did cooling pm just a few weeks ago and I listed what all I replaced. I think 100c is normal, as I stated in previous post, bentley manual states Coolant temperature working value K -bus 100C (212F). So this leads me to believe my coolant temp is where it should be?
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Old 01-12-2013, 05:47 AM   #90
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Actually if you see my earlier post you'll see that I did cooling pm just a few weeks ago and I listed what all I replaced. I think 100c is normal, as I stated in previous post, bentley manual states Coolant temperature working value K -bus 100C (212F). So this leads me to believe my coolant temp is where it should be?
Some of that might be that you're in AZ...though I don't know your current temps now, but it seems high to most of us here, even though it's within range.

Might be that you're driving very easy...maybe that plain water had been used before and you've got some deposits interfering with heat transfer in the engine...could be something like outside temp sensor, trans. thermostat (you didn't say you're replaced that, but I'm not sure if that affects coolant temp so much), or could be some aftermarket part you used...like an aluminum housing thermostat.

I'd keep an eye on it...you're a little higher than most here...usually 97-98 is the highest I've seen and then only in the summer.
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Old 01-12-2013, 10:27 AM   #91
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Some of that might be that you're in AZ...though I don't know your current temps now, but it seems high to most of us here, even though it's within range.

Might be that you're driving very easy...maybe that plain water had been used before and you've got some deposits interfering with heat transfer in the engine...could be something like outside temp sensor, trans. thermostat (you didn't say you're replaced that, but I'm not sure if that affects coolant temp so much), or could be some aftermarket part you used...like an aluminum housing thermostat.

I'd keep an eye on it...you're a little higher than most here...usually 97-98 is the highest I've seen and then only in the summer.

Sorry, I did replace the trans thermostat. I do all the work on my car and only use oem parts. Will definitely keep an eye on it as I do see most people on here seem to be running a little lower than I am. Outside temp doesn't seem to affect it at all as it dropped to 35F last night and it was 100C which is same as what it runs at in 70F weather during the day. I'll have to see what temps my coworkers are running as few have e46s to compare.
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Old 01-12-2013, 10:29 AM   #92
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Sorry, I did replace the trans thermostat. I do all the work on my car and only use oem parts. Will definitely keep an eye on it as I do see most people on here seem to be running a little lower than I am. Outside temp doesn't seem to affect it at all as it dropped to 35F last night and it was 100C which is same as what it runs at in 70F weather during the day. I'll have to see what temps my coworkers are running as few have e46s to compare.
Maybe you are a little low on coolant? Have you bled the system properly? Mine rarely goes to 96.
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Old 01-12-2013, 10:53 AM   #93
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Spdracr,

I'd also shoot a strong stream of water through condenser...and also, around the time of my next coolant change, I might consider using a flushing agent...even though your system is new, it isn't inside the engine.

Some few have managed to misroute the belts...that would affect the wp pressure...ditto a pulley seizing a bit...ditto if you've added underdrive pulleys.

Oh, also, you might just clean the contacts in your therm. Those few degrees you seem consistently high is probably something...could be a bad therm...as simple as that...not common but not unheard of.

Weird. Keep your eye on it...it doesn't sound serious, but it sounds like something nonetheless.
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Old 01-12-2013, 10:53 AM   #94
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Maybe you are a little low on coolant? Have you bled the system properly? Mine rarely goes to 96.
Yeah, I bled the coolant both per bmw instructions and with engine running. Coolant level is good, checked like 10 times in the past week. I did notice today the aux fan isn't kicking on for few seconds when the car first started like it's supposed to, so my aux fan or fuse might be bad so I'll have to look into that but I wouldn't think that would matter cruising 75 on the freeway.
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Old 01-12-2013, 11:08 AM   #95
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Spdracr,

I'd also shoot a strong stream of water through condenser...and also, around the time of my next coolant change, I might consider using a flushing agent...even though your system is new, it isn't inside the engine.

Some few have managed to misroute the belts...that would affect the wp pressure...ditto a pulley seizing a bit...ditto if you've added underdrive pulleys.

Oh, also, you might just clean the contacts in your therm. Those few degrees you seem consistently high is probably something...could be a bad therm...as simple as that...not common but not unheard of.

Weird. Keep your eye on it...it doesn't sound serious, but it sounds like something nonetheless.

I did check and cleaned the condenser to make sure there was no blockage when I replaced the radiator. I also, replaced all the pulleys and both tensioners while I was in there doing the water pump. Belt is on correct as I took picture of it before I removed it for reference and I have verified in the Bentley manual that is is on correct. I just noticed today, that my aux fan is not kicking in for few secs when first started but get no fan error when I scan the obd. Could that cause increase in temp? I would think that would only affect it at idle and shouldn't affect temps while cruising on the freeway.

Thanks for all the suggestions and taking the time to reply to my posts, I do appreciate it.
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Old 01-12-2013, 11:13 AM   #96
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how do you guys check your temps? Mine only shows the clock? Is that a thing for newer model cars? Mine is 99 323i..
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Old 01-12-2013, 01:06 PM   #97
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how do you guys check your temps? Mine only shows the clock? Is that a thing for newer model cars? Mine is 99 323i..
The procedure is outlined in the second link in jfoj's sig.

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Old 01-12-2013, 01:14 PM   #98
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Did my entire cooling system a few months ago. Even in low ambient temps, still running at good operating temp. 93 C coolant temp in 19 F ambient temp.
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Old 01-12-2013, 01:39 PM   #99
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Old 01-12-2013, 01:43 PM   #100
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i'm at 95-97 on the highway and 95-99 in city driving. Unaffected by the outside temp.
i have a graf WP and everything else is genuine bought from the dealer.
The car runs a bit hotter than i want it to. Could it be the graf WP?
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