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Political Talk
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Old 01-18-2013, 02:25 PM   #161
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I wouldn't call the revival of an weapons ban that was already in place and argued for even by people like Reagan "going for the jugular". I don't think it's the right move, but considering how little ground Republicans are giving, I wouldn't be surprised if they're overreaching so that they can get something.

Yes, there is always compromise. Every right comes with a compromise. Everything must bend a little given the right circumstances. Things that don't bend break instead.
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Old 01-18-2013, 02:36 PM   #162
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I wouldn't call the revival of an weapons ban that was already in place and argued for even by people like Reagan "going for the jugular". I don't think it's the right move, but considering how little ground Republicans are giving, I wouldn't be surprised if they're overreaching so that they can get something.

Yes, there is always compromise. Every right comes with a compromise. Everything must bend a little given the right circumstances. Things that don't bend break instead.
How could he have known it would be so unsuccessful. In that timeframe maybe I would have felt the same way but after seeing the lack of impact I doubt he would suport it today. We may never know.


This is were we differ somethings dont need to bend or break.

They just need to exist. Our country wasn't built on a foundation meant for bending and breaking.
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Old 01-18-2013, 02:39 PM   #163
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How could he have known it would be so unsuccessful. In that timeframe maybe I would have felt the same way but after seeing the lack of impact I doubt he would suport it today. We may never know.
If at first you don't succeed, give up?

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This is were we differ somethings dont need to bend or break.

They just need to exist. Our country wasn't built on a foundation meant for bending and breaking.
Are you saying the constitution was never meant to be amended?
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Old 01-18-2013, 02:40 PM   #164
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Are you saying the constitution was never meant to be amended?
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Old 01-18-2013, 05:24 PM   #165
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If at first you don't succeed, give up?


Are you saying the constitution was never meant to be amended?
No, revisit the problem from another angle instead of trying the same thing over and over.

Written right into the constitution for amendments.

I dont believe living constitutionalism applies to the 2nd. I think it was written just as it was intended.

It evolved from the english bill of rights that was enacted to directly protect protestants from being disarmed and controled by the crown.

allowing the basic natural right to self defense
to deter a tyrannical governement
to deter invasion

The founding fathers were directly influenced and meant for the 2nd to be written this way.

IMO times have not changed the natural right of self defense.
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Old 01-18-2013, 05:39 PM   #166
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The founding fathers were directly influenced and meant for the 2nd to be written this way.
I was under the impression that when it was first written, the 2d amendment was to address the right to bear arms in regards to Militias.

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A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.
To me, this means the founding fathers were influenced by the right to bare arms for militia purposes in defense of the state (in this context, against the British).

It wasn't until the SCOTUS ruled in 2008 and 2010 an official interpretation for an individual to have arms - unconnected to service in a militia, and in the use to the right for self defense.

Correct?
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Old 01-18-2013, 05:48 PM   #167
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Read the federalist papers, please
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Old 01-18-2013, 05:51 PM   #168
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Read the federalist papers, please
Thank you. That provides a better context. Learned something.
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Old 01-18-2013, 05:54 PM   #169
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I wouldn't call the revival of an weapons ban that was already in place and argued for even by people like Reagan "going for the jugular". I don't think it's the right move, but considering how little ground Republicans are giving, I wouldn't be surprised if they're overreaching so that they can get something.

Yes, there is always compromise. Every right comes with a compromise. Everything must bend a little given the right circumstances. Things that don't bend break instead.
Since when does a "right" come with compromise? How does that make sense?
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Old 01-18-2013, 07:16 PM   #170
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Since when does a "right" come with compromise? How does that make sense?
You can vote, but you're going to have to take a knowledge test to make sure you're doing so responsibly. It's a minor compromise, right?
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Old 01-18-2013, 08:25 PM   #171
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Since when does a "right" come with compromise? How does that make sense?
You can have free speech, but you can't incite hate or violence. Or would you like to argue that free speech entitles you to say ANYTHING you want?
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Old 01-18-2013, 08:33 PM   #172
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Thank you. That provides a better context. Learned something.
Read them and you'll have your answer from the horses mouth
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I agree with JonJon.
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Old 01-18-2013, 08:54 PM   #173
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Read them and you'll have your answer from the horses mouth
I plan to. Read some of it already. As a history buff, I find these tid bits interesting.
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Old 01-18-2013, 09:27 PM   #174
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You can have free speech, but you can't incite hate or violence. Or would you like to argue that free speech entitles you to say ANYTHING you want?
You can incite all the hate you want, what are you talking about.
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Old 01-18-2013, 09:37 PM   #175
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You can have free speech, but you can't incite hate or violence. Or would you like to argue that free speech entitles you to say ANYTHING you want?
Liberals are softies :p

j/k
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Old 01-18-2013, 09:50 PM   #176
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I plan to. Read some of it already. As a history buff, I find these tid bits interesting.
It's just easier to read it rather than have me or someone else paraphrase it and then have others argue about the wording of the paraphrasing, etc.

It is amazing how much information is out there, and how little people collectively know. I literally had someone pull the 'well-regulated means lots of regulations' argument today...smh
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Old 01-18-2013, 10:08 PM   #177
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It's just easier to read it rather than have me or someone else paraphrase it and then have others argue about the wording of the paraphrasing, etc.

It is amazing how much information is out there, and how little people collectively know. I literally had someone pull the 'well-regulated means lots of regulations' argument today...smh
Agree - I'll do my homework. I knew of the Federalist Papers, but never paid much attention to them, certainly not making the connection between them and the 2nd Amendment. I'm not anti-gun, but guns are not near and dear to me as what appears to be a lot of members on here. Either way, it's good to learn something new.
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Old 01-18-2013, 11:00 PM   #178
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Agree - I'll do my homework. I knew of the Federalist Papers, but never paid much attention to them, certainly not making the connection between them and the 2nd Amendment. I'm not anti-gun, but guns are not near and dear to me as what appears to be a lot of members on here. Either way, it's good to learn something new.
I don't own a single gun, I just defend liberty...even when it doesn't benefit me
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Old 01-18-2013, 11:15 PM   #179
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You can have free speech, but you can't incite hate or violence. Or would you like to argue that free speech entitles you to say ANYTHING you want?
Yes I can say whatever I want.

ANYTHING.
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Old 01-18-2013, 11:28 PM   #180
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Yes I can say whatever I want.

ANYTHING.
Anti hate laws will magically prevent you from saying hateful things, right?
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