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Old 12-29-2012, 02:15 PM   #1
properollin
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Exclamation Help! Crank no start, not fuel, no codes!

UPDATED! I really appreciate any input on this!

cranking good, but not starting. New fuel pump, new battery, tested 2 keys so its not the key.

For the last year there were times when my car would not even crank over, seemingly at random. I realized that if I unhook the battery and let it sit for a few minutes, then reattach battery, and turn the key, it will restart. Sometimes I had to wait longer than others, but never longer than 20 minutes. This was very rare so I never really messed with finding out the prob.

Jump ahead to a couple weeks ago when I posted this below:

A couple days prior to not starting it would crank a few times, and after a while eventually start. Then one morning dead, swapped the fuel pump, and verified fuel at the injector rail. I've now tested the coils, which all test .08.

Any other possible culprits besides crankshaft sensor?

I finally take the car to the stealer, who didn't have any codes or clue as to what the prob. was. They say they replaced fuse 67 for the immobilizer, and mentioned something about maybe one of my keys needing replaced (although both will start the car now). They were as confused as me but it was starting so I took it back (and paid them 180). The next day parked on a flat spot my car was doing the same thing, cranking but no start. I let it sit, didn't disconnect the battery or anything, and in about 20 min, cranked and it fired up.

No problems for a few days now untill today. I was parked on a steep incline, facing up the hill, and my car was totally dead, no lights, no crank. I was confused. i put car in nuetral and repositioned so I was facing downhill to jump start, but halfway through my turn, my dash came alive, I cranked, and it started.

I would appreciate any advice so that I don't get stranded somewhere, and since the stealer is confused too, I don't know what to do next!

Thanks for any advice!
D

Last edited by properollin; 01-16-2013 at 07:58 PM.
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Old 12-29-2012, 02:45 PM   #2
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Begin by testing your ignition coils; you'll need an ohmeter. If you don't have one you can do it the cheap way. You'll need a pair of thick gloves, and a screw driver. Pull the first coil out and connect the tip of the screw driver on the boot of the coil, while holding it in place and making contact touch the middle of the screw driver to a metal surface. If you see spark, that coil works, if it doesn't, that's your problem. If they all check out, I would recommend you replace your crankshaft position sensor! It'll be either one ! Let us know what happens ! Sorry, I'm at work so I just threw this together quickly.
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Old 12-29-2012, 02:56 PM   #3
properollin
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I'm on it, just about to test coils. Looked like the Crankshaft sensor was down on the bell housing and hard to reach, so i didn't want to have to do that unless I have to Any way to test it or is there any other alternative culprits? My fuel pressure jumps to 50 when priming, drops to 30 within a few minutes and holds there for quite a while. I think that is indicating fuel is fine but just want to be sure.
Thanks!
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Old 12-29-2012, 03:35 PM   #4
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I don't think there's any way to test the sensor. But, for $50-70 bucks, ill just replace it.
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Old 12-29-2012, 03:35 PM   #5
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Fuel pressure sounds good!
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Old 12-29-2012, 05:38 PM   #6
properollin
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Ignition coils are all showing .08, which as i understand is acceptable.

Also, I have tested an alternate key, but still no start. How can I confirm spark is being sent? Can I test for spark by cranking over the engine while watching for spark from a screwdriver stuck inside of a coil and placed close to engine block?

I really appreciate any other help or suggestions.
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Old 12-29-2012, 07:37 PM   #7
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Did you replace the crank sensor?
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Old 12-29-2012, 07:39 PM   #8
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Its the crank sensor.
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Old 12-29-2012, 07:41 PM   #9
always-there
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Quote:
Originally Posted by floydlloyd85 View Post
Its the crank sensor.
Yup. Let us know if you replaced it.
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Old 12-29-2012, 07:54 PM   #10
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Hopefully DMAX or E46Mango chime in.
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Old 12-29-2012, 08:05 PM   #11
properollin
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This is exactly what my car sounds like.


I didn't replace the crank sensor yet. I removed and cleaned my plugs just in case the car was flooded as I've read about. After I put back in I tested for fuel pressure at the rail and now I don't have any pressure! I'm confused now.

I'm going to check the fuel pressure gauge on another car tonight just in case it took a dump on me.
My pump is brand new and is sending a pulse when key in in position 2.

What else could get in the way of fuel pressure reaching the rail from the fuel pump? The filter? I replaced the filter a while back, prob 20K.
I'm probably looking at towing this sucker into the stealership on monday to diagnose. My fear is that last time is was there they diagnosed two things incorrectly, but they may be able to pull some codes I can't.
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Old 12-29-2012, 08:37 PM   #12
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Btw, have you double checked your work on the fuel pump?
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Old 12-29-2012, 09:05 PM   #13
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Did you prime the fuel line by holding key in pos 2 for 10 secs. then off for 10 secs. on again for 10 secs. then off...then try to start.

Or, try for flooded engine. Hold pedal down halfway while trying to crank.

Find local fanatic in your regional forum who can come over and read codes for you.

Check Kalim Fuse in e-box (powers FP relay). Make sure pump is going (as mentioned).

Make sure you really have gas...fuel sender often fails...so you could try adding a few gallons.

At some point, you'll need a jump with all this cranking.

HTH
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Old 12-29-2012, 09:10 PM   #14
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Brand name fuel pump?
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Old 12-29-2012, 09:35 PM   #15
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Did you slide the fuel pump connector "bail" to lock the connector to the fuel pump??

See the 2nd link in my signature with info on the fuel pump connector.

Also have you checked the fuses in the glove box and the Ebox under the hood?
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Solve your misfires, lean codes, rough idle - http://forum.e46fanatics.com/showthread.php?t=897616

Fuel pump failures - http://forum.e46fanatics.com/showthread.php?t=929501

Temp Info - http://forum.e46fanatics.com/showthread.php?t=964491

Hidden OBC Menu - Check Voltage, Temps, Fuel Level - http://forum.e46fanatics.com/showthread.php?t=239619

E46/E39 GM5 Door Lock Info - www.bmwgm5.com

Lower hose fan switch O-ring - BMW #13621743299
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Old 12-29-2012, 09:50 PM   #16
properollin
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Red face stumped!

Thanks for the input guys. I installed the new pump first thing, although I could hear the old pump working, so it was probably ok. The new one comes on fine, and im not sure how I could have messed up, the pump is pretty simple.

I checked the fuel pump fuse and kalim fuse prior to swapping fuel pump.
Since I had fuel pressure at the rail, at one point anyway, I ruled out anything fuel related, bit now im not sure.

I used an obd2 code reader and didn't get anything.

What does pressing down accelerator do while cranking,would it be helpful or create flooding so the plugs need removed cleaned and dried.

I plan on using carb cleaner to see if I can start Tom. If so I can know I have spark, and find out if it is fuel related.

Any other input would be awesome
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Old 12-29-2012, 09:52 PM   #17
properollin
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Yes the locking clip is is in place. I can hear the pump priming.
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Old 12-29-2012, 10:47 PM   #18
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Throttle to the floor puts electronics in "clear flood mode", shuts off injectors from firing, so no fuel is added when throttle is floored when cranking.
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Solve your misfires, lean codes, rough idle - http://forum.e46fanatics.com/showthread.php?t=897616

Fuel pump failures - http://forum.e46fanatics.com/showthread.php?t=929501

Temp Info - http://forum.e46fanatics.com/showthread.php?t=964491

Hidden OBC Menu - Check Voltage, Temps, Fuel Level - http://forum.e46fanatics.com/showthread.php?t=239619

E46/E39 GM5 Door Lock Info - www.bmwgm5.com

Lower hose fan switch O-ring - BMW #13621743299
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Old 12-30-2012, 12:08 AM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jfoj View Post
Throttle to the floor puts electronics in "clear flood mode", shuts off injectors from firing, so no fuel is added when throttle is floored when cranking.
Now that's the kind of stuff I want to learn but wouldn't know where to go to find it. Where did you know that from? And is that true to all drive by wire cars, or just BMW's?
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Old 12-30-2012, 12:34 AM   #20
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True for at least my previous VW Passat. So I will fathom a guess and say true for all DBW cars
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