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Political Talk
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Old 02-13-2013, 02:41 PM   #61
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It's not a conservative value to regulate procreation.
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Old 02-13-2013, 04:54 PM   #62
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It's not a conservative value to regulate procreation.
It is a "conservative" value to be responsible, it should be a human value to be responsible. The fact that we can't even tell people they are irresponsible idiots anymore without being labeled something heinous shows what a sad state we've slid into.
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Old 02-13-2013, 04:56 PM   #63
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I was poor once then I got a paper route when I was 11 helped my mom, then I got a work permit and worked at the local grocery store from 14-15 then at 16 I got a job at Toys R us at all times while helping my mom. And so on and so forth..

We were on welfare, mother was disabled with 3 kids, father paid child support. Mother was off welfare after we turned 18, father then had to pay the government supplementary income above and beyond child support order.

Here in Massachusetts guys pay the state back for the welfare women use, now known as Department of Transitional Assistance.

I was poor once, I was a kid and didn't wish to die.
Are you new?

That was straight sarcasm. It's the answer that most modern republicans have for any question about the poor or our nation's uninsured.
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Old 02-13-2013, 05:01 PM   #64
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Old 02-14-2013, 01:43 AM   #65
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They're paying the lowest effective rates in 40 years.

According to the Wall Street Journal's recent study of Congressional Budget Office numbers, corporations are paying an effective rate of 12.1%, the lowest in at least 40 years.
Read more: http://business.time.com/2012/02/06/...#ixzz2KrByE9Y3

The article and your graphs don't add-up. It says our average, effective tax rate is 25.6% (outside of the current, stimulus-induced tax breaks) over the last 30 years. But your graphs say our average tax rate in ~13%. Do you know the reason for that discrepancy?

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So why are some of the biggest and most powerful entities in our society getting away with paying so little? The story is complicated, but the biggest factor in the recent collapse in corporate tax receipts appears to be a set of tax breaks built into recent stimulus efforts.

In 2010 and 2011, companies were allowed to deduct the full cost of the purchases of new equipment, while normally these costs would be expensed over several years. In 2012, this deduction will go down to 50% and be eliminated altogether thereafter, causing the effective tax rate to return to roughly the 25.6% average effective tax rate corporations paid since the late 1980s, according to CBO forecasts.

Also, I don't have a good solution for increasing wealth in the country. I asked Hayabua many time for his input. He doesn't seem to have any either. I would love to have a nation where EVERYONE was wealthy. I just don't have any bright ideas on how to make it happen. And as I have calculated many times, if you take our nations wealth and distribute it equally, it is approximately $55k/year for everyone. That is hardly wealthy. Maybe we have too many people for our current economy? That is sort of a joke - but maybe we can't support our population with our current GDP? Did anyone ever think of it that way?
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Old 02-14-2013, 07:17 AM   #66
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The article and your graphs don't add-up. It says our average, effective tax rate is 25.6% (outside of the current, stimulus-induced tax breaks) over the last 30 years. But your graphs say our average tax rate in ~13%. Do you know the reason for that discrepancy?


Last year vs "over the last 30 years"...

According to WSJ: "Total corporate federal taxes paid fell to 12.1% of profits earned from activities within the U.S. in fiscal 2011, which ended Sept. 30, according to the Congressional Budget Office. That's the lowest level since at least 1972. And well below the 25.6% companies paid on average from 1987 to 2008." http://online.wsj.com/article/SB1000...233215330.html

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Also, I don't have a good solution for increasing wealth in the country. I asked Hayabua many time for his input. He doesn't seem to have any either. I would love to have a nation where EVERYONE was wealthy.
I don't. Not everyone needs to be wealthy. People should, however, not have to fear illness and poverty if they're lucky to be born in the best country on Earth...

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I just don't have any bright ideas on how to make it happen. And as I have calculated many times, if you take our nations wealth and distribute it equally, it is approximately $55k/year for everyone. That is hardly wealthy. Maybe we have too many people for our current economy? That is sort of a joke - but maybe we can't support our population with our current GDP? Did anyone ever think of it that way?
That's a silly proposition that no one is making. No one wants to redistribute all the wealth equally, but for the sake of a healthy economy the gap needs to shrink. I think of the country as a lifter on steroids who only works out his upper body. Great biceps and chest, but legs like twigs. We need an overall healthy economy. Not so that everyone is equal, but so that everyone matters.
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What are we to do?
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Old 02-14-2013, 07:24 AM   #67
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That's a silly proposition that no one is making. No one wants to redistribute all the wealth equally, but for the sake of a healthy economy the gap needs to shrink. I think of the country as a lifter on steroids who only works out his upper body. Great biceps and chest, but legs like twigs. We need an overall healthy economy. Not so that everyone is equal, but so that everyone matters.
the more you lift the floor, the more you restrict the ceiling. The last this country needs is to inject more money into a universally wasteful, inept and corrupt central government that will squander the majority of it.

Your trust in people based on the mere fact that they got idiots to vote for them is troubling.
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Old 02-14-2013, 07:26 AM   #68
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It is a "conservative" value to be responsible, it should be a human value to be responsible. The fact that we can't even tell people they are irresponsible idiots anymore without being labeled something heinous shows what a sad state we've slid into.
So the only responsible thing for a woman to do when she gets pregnant while only making minimum wage is to have an abortion. Correct?
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Old 02-14-2013, 07:36 AM   #69
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So the only responsible thing for a woman to do when she gets pregnant while only making minimum wage is to have an abortion. Correct?
Finally someone gets it
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Old 02-14-2013, 07:38 AM   #70
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Finally someone gets it
Good luck telling that to a "conservative" in America.
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Old 02-14-2013, 07:45 AM   #71
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the more you lift the floor, the more you restrict the ceiling. The last this country needs is to inject more money into a universally wasteful, inept and corrupt central government that will squander the majority of it.

Your trust in people based on the mere fact that they got idiots to vote for them is troubling.
I have no idea what point you're trying to make.
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What are we to do?
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Old 02-14-2013, 07:53 AM   #72
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I have no idea what point you're trying to make.
Members of the House and Senate are paid minimum wage. That's the only way it make sense to me.
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Old 02-14-2013, 07:57 AM   #73
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So the only responsible thing for a woman to do when she gets pregnant while only making minimum wage is to have an abortion. Correct?
Yes, you are 100% correct. It is an obvious (and effective) solution. I don't know why you framed the question as if I would say no though...
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Old 02-14-2013, 08:06 AM   #74
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Yes, you are 100% correct. It is an obvious (and effective) solution. I don't know why you framed the question as if I would say no though...
So you condone murder?
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Old 02-14-2013, 09:22 AM   #75
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..
Says the guy who said Obama is our boss and like our father.
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"They". Again with this idea that white people are a singular organism with a single will.

Individuals make choices and take actions. Sometimes their race informs their choices and actions, sometimes it does not.
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Old 02-14-2013, 09:25 AM   #76
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Says the guy who said Obama is our boss and like our father.

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Old 02-14-2013, 10:55 AM   #77
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Man, this sounds a lot like to each according to their needs, from each according to their ability.
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Old 02-14-2013, 12:00 PM   #78
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When does it stop? The two mouth breathers they found to speak on the nightly news (ABC) last night spelled out their excitement to "buy more stuff." We need to close the loopholes for this end of society instead of make it easier for them. I needed more money at 15 than my minimum wage ice cream job provided, I got certified as a lifeguard so I could make 10 bucks an hour. Unless you put them against a wall, how are they going to better themselves to succeed?

1. Servers must declare all cash tips. (They tend to declare about 1/4 - 1/2)
2. When work slows, tradesman typically lay their employee off for a few weeks to collect. Then hire them back when they have a new job. This needs to end.(Also results in extremely inaccurate unemployment estimates because of the fluctuations)
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Old 02-14-2013, 12:45 PM   #79
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Busa, why is that at all immoral? I am not responsible for the CHOICES of other individuals. Is it IMMORAL for me to not care if someone commits suicide? I think not. Let people live and die by their OWN CHOICES. That is the primary driver and the MOST IMPORTANT aspect of a free market.

If someone CHOOSES to go sans-healthcare, they must live (or die) with the consequences. Under what system is it just or reasonable to allow some to live so frivolously and pass those costs onto others? I understand you wish for the world's largest nanny state in which NOBODY is responsible for anything and everyone can do whatever they please.. but that is NOT the world in which the US thrived and is NOT a world I want anything to do with.

To sit there and slander someone because you disagree with their opinions on matters...
You're responsible for others..you didn't know this?
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Old 02-14-2013, 12:47 PM   #80
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Man, this sounds a lot like to each according to their needs, from each according to their ability.
Since we're exaggerating...

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