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DIY: Do It Yourself
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Old 02-24-2013, 10:30 AM   #1
Redflea
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SOLVED: Siren installed, Alarm enabled, but no sound...help!?

Someone suggested I would get better traction on this posting about this here...

http://forum.e46fanatics.com/showthread.php?t=972778

Sadly, this turned out to be primarily an operator error issue...connector was not fully seated on siren.

Also learned that:

1. You don't need a motion sensor installed to have a working alarm system
2. If you don't have a working or connected siren, you'll get no flashing lights or other notification if the alarm is tripped, just the clown nose will blink quickly.

Last edited by Redflea; 02-27-2013 at 09:52 PM.
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Old 02-25-2013, 04:22 AM   #2
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when you say no sound, you mean as in..l.. unlock/lock or youar alarm being set off.
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Old 02-25-2013, 06:09 AM   #3
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Just for fun, remove continuous tone and replace it by interval tone. I had an issue with a 330CI that wouldn't work on continuous but quasi-functioned on interval leading me to diagnose the siren as being defective.

The OEM alarm siren is nothing more than a piezzo after all with modulating programability.
They aren't tough when it comes to impact resistance and humidity deterrence. All it takes is one stock boy to drop it or a delivery truck being too humid and bye bye electronics.

By far the simplest thing to do, seeing as how you're ill equipped for 12v testing; head to RadioShack and pick up any 12V piezzo siren. They all function the same but the RadioShack version will be a 2 wire only. Use the search function for the forum and locate a Alarm install/Piezzo install by another member. He has a very well documented DIY on how to install a 3$ Piezzo as the main alarm siren.

If for some reason the Piezzo replacement doesn't work (which I would be baffled if it wouldn't), go to any auto parts store, Snap On, Mac tools, or whatever and buy yourself a QUALITY multimeter.
(A multimeter is never a waste of money, you can always use it in your home as well. Quality tools can also be bought used pretty often from Craigslist or other).
Use the mutlimeter to check voltage at the Siren connector with the proper wiring diagram. If for some reason voltages aren't present, a quality multimeter will have the continuity function. (the continuity function allows you to test the integrity of a given circuit by sending a low voltage through it. Great for fault tracing).

With this information Redflea, you should be able to diagnose your problem within 10 minutes of having your cabin filter trim disassembled.

Good luck.
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Old 02-25-2013, 09:10 AM   #4
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Originally Posted by NumbaOneNewb View Post
when you say no sound, you mean as in..l.. unlock/lock or youar alarm being set off.
Thanks, both actually. No sound when I lock or unlock, no sound or lights when the alarm is triggered.

Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Bimmer App

Last edited by Redflea; 02-25-2013 at 09:11 AM.
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Old 02-25-2013, 09:19 AM   #5
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Originally Posted by drift.mechanic View Post
Just for fun, remove continuous tone and replace it by interval tone. I had an issue with a 330CI that wouldn't work on continuous but quasi-functioned on interval leading me to diagnose the siren as being defective.

The OEM alarm siren is nothing more than a piezzo after all with modulating programability.
They aren't tough when it comes to impact resistance and humidity deterrence. All it takes is one stock boy to drop it or a delivery truck being too humid and bye bye electronics.

By far the simplest thing to do, seeing as how you're ill equipped for 12v testing; head to RadioShack and pick up any 12V piezzo siren. They all function the same but the RadioShack version will be a 2 wire only. Use the search function for the forum and locate a Alarm install/Piezzo install by another member. He has a very well documented DIY on how to install a 3$ Piezzo as the main alarm siren.

If for some reason the Piezzo replacement doesn't work (which I would be baffled if it wouldn't), go to any auto parts store, Snap On, Mac tools, or whatever and buy yourself a QUALITY multimeter.
(A multimeter is never a waste of money, you can always use it in your home as well. Quality tools can also be bought used pretty often from Craigslist or other).
Use the mutlimeter to check voltage at the Siren connector with the proper wiring diagram. If for some reason voltages aren't present, a quality multimeter will have the continuity function. (the continuity function allows you to test the integrity of a given circuit by sending a low voltage through it. Great for fault tracing).

With this information Redflea, you should be able to diagnose your problem within 10 minutes of having your cabin filter trim disassembled.

Good luck.
Thanks...I'll take a look for the Piezzo alarm. Though my wife is a "if it isn't stock, I won't have it!" kinda gal, so my expectation is that we'll be getting another BMW siren if this one is kaput.
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Old 02-25-2013, 09:35 AM   #6
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I too enjoy the sound the newer BMW sirens make when they chirp. It's that new age metallic klang sound that feels good to the ears. So you actually had the original siren working and one day it stopped?

Update: reread your post. who installed your siren? Who activate the alarm?
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Old 02-25-2013, 09:40 AM   #7
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One more thing I have a feeling youre not talking about a 3 series but rather a 5. Go on! Scram! Jk. No you couldn't be. One last question is your clown nose blinking when you arm it? I have lots of experience dealing with this area. Im sure I can figure it out
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Old 02-25-2013, 12:33 PM   #8
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Originally Posted by NumbaOneNewb View Post
One more thing I have a feeling youre not talking about a 3 series but rather a 5. Go on! Scram! Jk. No you couldn't be. One last question is your clown nose blinking when you arm it? I have lots of experience dealing with this area. Im sure I can figure it out
Yup - 3 series...I have the e39, wife has the e46 (2005 330ci vert).

Basically the saga is:

- No siren or tilt sensor installed
- Lights blinked when car locked/unlocked

I installed siren and tilt sensor:

- no change, lights blinked when lock/unlock

Then used BMW scanner to enable DWA and tilt sensor, and enable chirps when locked/unlocked:

- Lights still blinked when I locked unlocked
- Still no chirp
- Clown nose now blinked slowly when alarm set, fast when I triggered alarm (panic button or open hood)
- No siren sound

Then I used BMW scanner to turn off chirps and light blink when unlock/lock (someone suggested this) and then turned them back on again.

- Lights no longer blink
- Still no chirp
- Clown nose no longer blinks
- Still no siren sound

Since then I've disabled/enabled DWA settings several times, upgraded the version of the PA Soft software to 1.4.0.9 (current, as far as I can tell) and am unable to get back even what I had in the beginning, just the lights blinking when I locked/unlocked.

I believe the problem is w/the BMW scanner 1.4 software not writing to the right spots or not writing the correct info to the ZKE module.

BMW scanner did seem to allow me to initially enable the alarm (since I had the clown nose blinking and could set it off into fast blink by setting off the alarm), but once I touched the settings again things haven't been working. The write process in PA Soft completes w/a confirmation that the write completed, but the car clearly isn't seeing the change(s).

I think I'm going to have to throw in the towel on the BMW Scanner/PA Soft SW combo and move to NCS Expert. Maybe I'm having less luck than others due to a newer model year, or because my car's a vert - I saw a post from another user on the BMW Scanner thread saying that he also was having problems enabling his alarm...

Appreciate any suggestions...

I'm now looking for the best "getting started" link for NCS Expert if you have any info on that.

Last edited by Redflea; 02-25-2013 at 12:37 PM.
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Old 02-25-2013, 12:39 PM   #9
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Suggest you disconnect the battery for at least 5 minutes, reconnect the battery and see what happens.

If you still have issues, start the car and have it running when coding the module or get a battery charger on the car when coding the module.

I would try to set everything back to a default state, save everything, then try to recode.

These module are very sensitive to Voltage when coding and sometimes will hang.
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Old 02-25-2013, 12:55 PM   #10
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Originally Posted by jfoj View Post
Suggest you disconnect the battery for at least 5 minutes, reconnect the battery and see what happens.

If you still have issues, start the car and have it running when coding the module or get a battery charger on the car when coding the module.

I would try to set everything back to a default state, save everything, then try to recode.

These module are very sensitive to Voltage when coding and sometimes will hang.
Thanks...so when you were coding did you ever have instances when the coding appeared to go fine (no errors, good confirmation messages appeared saying the changes were written) but then the settings weren't taking effect?

Last edited by Redflea; 02-25-2013 at 01:41 PM.
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Old 02-25-2013, 01:34 PM   #11
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I just did the coding w/the engine running...went in and disabled all the Anti-Theft/DWA settings in that right column. Wrote that.

Then exited PA Soft, restarted it and rescanned for modules and re-enabled the settings.

Same as before - no blinking lights, no blinking clown nose, no chirp.

I guess disconnecting the battery is next, if that still seems like it's likely to help.
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Old 02-25-2013, 02:07 PM   #12
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Disconnected battery, reconnected battery, and things are now back at square 2. ;-)

By that I mean:

- Lights blinking at lock/unlock again
- Clown nose blinking at lock again
- No chirping from siren

Very happy to have it back to semi-normal, thanks for the battery disconnect suggestion, Jfoj. Duh...rebooting the computer is always the first thing I tell my kids to do.

So it looks like it's a dead siren, since the coding is working on the other items...that make sense?
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Old 02-25-2013, 02:07 PM   #13
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Sometimes you have to flip the settings and save them. Post a screen shot once you get a chance to see what is configured.

Good luck.
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Old 02-25-2013, 03:13 PM   #14
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You know, since the chip/siren didn't turn on from the first time I ever coded anything, when things were "fresh", and the lights and all other settings I enabled at that time (lock after 2min if unlock and don't open, lock at xmph, etc.) did work, I'm pretty sure (famous last words? ) that the siren I got from a car being parted out is dead.

Additional evidence is that I was doing a few unlock/lock cycles today and at one point heard a very sad sounding noise from the front of the car that sound suspiciously like a sound that a mostly dead siren might make.

I'm going to be going near an auto recycler later today on the way to an appointment and they said they have sirens for $25-$35, guaranteed to work, so I'm going to grab one of those and bring it home and hook it up and see what happens...a risk-free way that should confirm if it's the siren or not.

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Old 02-25-2013, 05:00 PM   #15
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Since it's already a used part I would advise to try an run power straight to it. I will put money on it that it will go off. I think I know what's wrong. Like I said, I've read a lot about the gm5 unit and all it's functions. When they built the security system, they built it as a complete unit . I noticed you said you only did tilt sensor. What about the interior sensor? You can also confirm it's function by hooking it up to your car. I could be wrong but when you wrote the coding initiating the tilt sensor the car will automatically look for it's buddies. They are all tied together. There's this wire called the stdwa or something like that, which you can kind of call it the ground when armed wire. It's actually located nearby the tilt sensor. From there, all the sensors and siren report back to that spot in a sense, asking each other are they awake. If one of them doesn't report back, then there's a problem.

I was about to ask you to try and disable an disconnect the sensors and leave the siren in to see if it would work but I don't think so. On my car I hooked up a radio shack 2 tone piezo buzzer which so far is the closes thing to oem I've heard. It's definitely worth my $15. It works but the way I have it wired is only with 2 wires hooked up. One to the power and the other to trigger. With 2 left I know one should be the arm when ground and the other might be the "hey, are you alive buddy?" wire. Like I said hook it up to your car or the easier option is to run a power and ground wire to 2 of the 4 holes although I'm not sure which one
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Old 02-25-2013, 07:59 PM   #16
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Since it's already a used part I would advise to try an run power straight to it. I will put money on it that it will go off. I think I know what's wrong. Like I said, I've read a lot about the gm5 unit and all it's functions. When they built the security system, they built it as a complete unit . I noticed you said you only did tilt sensor. What about the interior sensor? You can also confirm it's function by hooking it up to your car. I could be wrong but when you wrote the coding initiating the tilt sensor the car will automatically look for it's buddies. They are all tied together. There's this wire called the stdwa or something like that, which you can kind of call it the ground when armed wire. It's actually located nearby the tilt sensor. From there, all the sensors and siren report back to that spot in a sense, asking each other are they awake. If one of them doesn't report back, then there's a problem.

I was about to ask you to try and disable an disconnect the sensors and leave the siren in to see if it would work but I don't think so. On my car I hooked up a radio shack 2 tone piezo buzzer which so far is the closes thing to oem I've heard. It's definitely worth my $15. It works but the way I have it wired is only with 2 wires hooked up. One to the power and the other to trigger. With 2 left I know one should be the arm when ground and the other might be the "hey, are you alive buddy?" wire. Like I said hook it up to your car or the easier option is to run a power and ground wire to 2 of the 4 holes although I'm not sure which one
Thanks...that's interesting. I don't know specifically if anyone has had trouble hooking up just the siren and tilt in a convertible or hard top...

If this is necessary and I knew which wires to cut it would be easy to do...

Jfoj - did you install just the siren and tilt, or did you do the interior motion sensors as well?

Last edited by Redflea; 02-25-2013 at 09:10 PM.
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Old 02-26-2013, 01:36 AM   #17
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No you wouldn't want to cut any of the wires. I'd recommend tapping into the necessary ones only but this would only apply to the siren. The sensors would be obsolete. Could've went aftermarket for those sensors, and it would function the de at a fraction of the cost. Yeah now I remember. The stdwa is similar to a armed when ground wire. The alarm specialist who wrote the it on how to do a remote starter for our cars feels that that was all it was, although hen we tapped into it, it didn't do as its supposedly implied name. I felt that the stdwa wire acted more like a wire circuit. In order to ground when armed, all the pieces must be in their positions to help complete it. The other wire sends a constant electrical impulse to all the sensors to see if they're responding.

One more thing swear I remember during my excavation of information written by BMW explaining the process it is the interior cabin sensor that is key in order for the alarm to activate in conjunction with the siren. It was the tilt sensor that could be left out, or maybe not even then. As I stated the ground when armed wire from all the other sensors all met up right by the tilt sensor. What I do know is Say for example test my theory in your 5 series. First try siting in the backseat and aticating your alarm. Does it arm? If it does arm, next try disconnecting it entirely and let us know what you fine. After your experimet, if you find that the alarm on your 5 series is acting up, use the pa soft tool to clear out any errors in the ews unit and Zke Aka gm5 Aka central body electronics
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Old 02-26-2013, 01:44 AM   #18
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Oh yeah wait! Before you try any of that, try this first. Very easy. Have tilt and siren installed, use BMW scanner to activate alarm and tilt and interior monitor even though you don't have one. Clear error codes from ews and Zke and try it
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Old 02-26-2013, 11:12 AM   #19
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Oh yeah wait! Before you try any of that, try this first. Very easy. Have tilt and siren installed, use BMW scanner to activate alarm and tilt and interior monitor even though you don't have one. Clear error codes from ews and Zke and try it
I've tried that already, but since I was having issues at that point when I tried to update settings with BMW Scanner (which I fixed by the battery disconnect/reboot that Jfoj recommended) it's probably worth trying again. I also haven't cleared any of the ZKE error codes, I believe last time I looked I didn't have any error codes in EWS but I'll have to check again.

Just to be safe I'm going to uninstall/re-install BMW Scanner on my laptop and rescan and see what it sees as currently set, and then try above. I frankly don't expect it to help, but it's easy to try.

EDIT: So I did this, enabled interior sensors, front and back, and no change. I did, once again, temporarily lost clown nose and lights flash when I locked/unlocked, but disconnected battery, reconnected and drove around for a bit and it all came back. So still no siren, everything else seems enabled.

What no one has ever confirmed for me, interestingly, is the following:

Is it normal to hear two very short, very quiet chirps when you first connect a siren? That's what happened when I first connected mine. I've never been able to find out if that is normal, or if the siren should make normally loud chirps to confirm it is working, or what?

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Old 02-26-2013, 02:23 PM   #20
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I would assume that since there's power live at the connector that plugging it in like that would cause the unit to make that sound. Perhaps equivalent to when you plug headphones or an aux connection to your computer or stereo. Even with no music playing, it causes that short burst of static like sound indicating it's live. I am surprised you haven't looked at the Zke errors. I also am highly reccommending that you stop disconnecting your battery like that. That should never be a go to solution for resetting things. If something isn't functioning normally than there's an underlying issue behind it and a battery reset is not an acceptable solution but hey it's your wifes cat so do what you will. I can almost guarantee that with no interior sensor in that at least that error should remain constant and not clearable in there. Trust me, I have a lot of experience with these cars especially with the gm5 module. I have resolved many in person problems people have had with this module . Please check this fore. When you scan using the scanner theres a popup screen that shows you the list of options your car has. Is the anti theft security in there (I will assume it is) but are the sensors also listed on there?
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