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Gun Talk
Are you a gun fanatic as well? If so, you'll want to talk to other owners about what you own in this forum.

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Old 03-03-2013, 12:16 PM   #1
NFRs2000nyc
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Any opinions on this upper?

Ok guys, I have two uppers (stripped) sitting at home, a Spike and a Noveske. All the other parts I have are top shelf (Magpul FRS stock, gissele trigger, BAD safety, etc.) Since I am looking for an upper, my plans were to build one middle quality rifle, and one top shelf rifle. I emailed both White Oak and Wilson to see who can get me an upper first, and depending on who "wins" will determine which rifle gets built. The white oak is basically half the price of the Wilson, but I figured with the parts on this thing, along with being a Noveske lower it would be worth it to built it top end all the way.

So anywho, what do you guys think of this upper?
http://shopwilsoncombat.com/Complete...-223SS20UP-NF/
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Old 03-03-2013, 05:14 PM   #2
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The Wilson barrels are really good, and they're very accurate. That thing is ridiculously heavy though. It's 10oz heavier than its Noveske counterpart. That rifle is basically going to be a bench rifle. I would be fine with the Wilson setup, but either would be good. Both companies make accurate rifles.
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Old 03-03-2013, 06:09 PM   #3
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Originally Posted by Reedo302 View Post
The Wilson barrels are really good, and they're very accurate. That thing is ridiculously heavy though. It's 10oz heavier than its Noveske counterpart. That rifle is basically going to be a bench rifle. I would be fine with the Wilson setup, but either would be good. Both companies make accurate rifles.
Would you say they are worth almost 2x the price of say a white oak or an RRA? I have no problem paying for quality, but if it's not THAT much better I don't know if it's worth spending the extra coin. I'm not planning on clearing a building so this will be solely a range rifle and probably even a bench sniper rifle.
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Old 03-03-2013, 06:43 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NFRs2000nyc View Post
Would you say they are worth almost 2x the price of say a white oak or an RRA? I have no problem paying for quality, but if it's not THAT much better I don't know if it's worth spending the extra coin. I'm not planning on clearing a building so this will be solely a range rifle and probably even a bench sniper rifle.
Link to the WOA upper? I would take the wilson/woa over the RRA.

Is the WOA upper complete? BCG/CH like the wilson?

Also which rail do you like better? Post a link to the WOA upper you are looking at so it's easier to compare. Both companies seem to make great barrels, I just went with an 18" Noveske SPR barrel for my SPRish build.
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Old 03-03-2013, 07:16 PM   #5
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Link to the WOA upper? I would take the wilson/woa over the RRA.

Is the WOA upper complete? BCG/CH like the wilson?

Also which rail do you like better? Post a link to the WOA upper you are looking at so it's easier to compare. Both companies seem to make great barrels, I just went with an 18" Noveske SPR barrel for my SPRish build.
http://www.whiteoakarmament.com/xcart/home.php?cat=261
Im looking at the 20" but not sure if I need a 1:7 or a 1:12 twist. Seems ideal is a 1:8 twist but they don't make one.....nor do I understand the difference in terms of what effects that has on the round.

I checked out Noveske uppers and those are even MORE money ($1500!!)

As for the rails, I prefer the tacticool look of the Wilson rails.
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Old 03-03-2013, 07:29 PM   #6
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i would go for a noveske, but that wilson is a nice upper.
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Old 03-03-2013, 07:34 PM   #7
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i would go for a noveske, but that wilson is a nice upper.
As much I like like it, the wilson is already pushing it (I can build both rifles if I stick with something like WOA) at $1200....$1500 for a Noveske upper is pretty damn steep. I know I know, you gotta pay to play, but Im not a super sniper and even something like a WOA will greatly outshoot me. Operators like Reedo will probably have a 1/2" group at 500 yards but since my range is max 250 (or 300 I don't remember) and I was nailing golf balls with my friends off the shelf STAG AR, I don't want to piss money away. On the other hand, I guess it would be nice to have at least one rifle that will hold value for years to come and something I may even pass on to my kids.
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Old 03-03-2013, 08:22 PM   #8
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Wilson makes a top shelf upper.

White oak makes a great barrel. I dont know much about the rest of their uppers. But if the barrel is $300 from them alone. For $350 your getting an upper assembly, rail, gas block, gas tube bcg and ch i would be doing some more research into the rest of the components, seems way cheaper then other match grade uppers.

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Old 03-03-2013, 09:03 PM   #9
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Originally Posted by Adam@Euro-Spec View Post
Wilson makes a top shelf upper.

White oak makes a great barrel. I dont know much about the rest of their uppers. But if the barrel is $300 from them alone. For $350 your getting an upper assembly, rail, gas block, gas tube bcg and ch i would be doing some more research into the rest of the components, seems way cheaper then other match grade uppers.

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But is the cost of top shelf parts really that much, or do manufacturers charge a ton more because of their name? Like I said, I don't know much about AR parts, but I assume they are all machined metal of equal grade, so the differences *should* be pretty minor....
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Old 03-03-2013, 11:30 PM   #10
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With Wilson you are definitely paying for the name. We use Wilson Combat 870 shotguns. The models we use are the Professional 14". They're NOT worth the money we pay, which is A LOT. I could build a shotgun of equal quality using a standard Remington 870 police model as a base model for a lot less.

Here's what I would do- call WOA and check to see if the .223WOA chambering is equivalent to the .223Wylde chambering. Make sure you can shoot 5.56 spec cartridges out of that upper. That is the key, because if you ever wanted to shoot Mk262 Mod1 ammunition from Black Hills, or any other 5.56 load, you need a chamber than can support it. Make sure that the chamber is not a .223Rem only setup. Also, ask what they will guarantee for accuracy. If you can get a 1MOA or sub-MOA accuracy guarantee, that's good.

WOA uses Wilson blanks, so you're essentially getting almost the same barrel. The difference is really in the cut of the rifle bore.
If accuracy and bench use is the only concern, I see no reason to spend the extra money on the Wilson, as you'll likely get the same performance out of the WOA. You're getting decent components. I wouldn't so much go for RRA, but WOA is pretty decent. My brother's 16" WOA barrel is a tack driver.

As far as the twist rate, if your sole purpose is varmint hunting, where you will be shooting bullets 60gr or less in weight, the 1:12 is ideal. Varmint bullets are generally either a ballistic tip, JSP or HP design with a very thin copper jacket. Since the jackets are not very strong, they can actually rip right off if the bullet is going too fast and spins too much. This is primarily with the 40gr-52gr varmint bullets.
However, if you want long range precision for target shooting, you should be shooting a 68gr or heavier load. Preferable a 68, 69, 75 or 77gr BTHP/OTM match load. For all of these, you need that tighter 1:7 twist. For everything across the board, get the 1:7. You can varmint hunt with Hornady 75gr BTHPs and Sierra 69gr SMKs, but you shouldn't be doing 600yd precision shots with Hornady 40gr V-Max loads.
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Old 03-03-2013, 11:54 PM   #11
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Originally Posted by Reedo302 View Post
With Wilson you are definitely paying for the name. We use Wilson Combat 870 shotguns. The models we use are the Professional 14". They're NOT worth the money we pay, which is A LOT. I could build a shotgun of equal quality using a standard Remington 870 police model as a base model for a lot less.

Here's what I would do- call WOA and check to see if the .223WOA chambering is equivalent to the .223Wylde chambering. Make sure you can shoot 5.56 spec cartridges out of that upper. That is the key, because if you ever wanted to shoot Mk262 Mod1 ammunition from Black Hills, or any other 5.56 load, you need a chamber than can support it. Make sure that the chamber is not a .223Rem only setup. Also, ask what they will guarantee for accuracy. If you can get a 1MOA or sub-MOA accuracy guarantee, that's good.

WOA uses Wilson blanks, so you're essentially getting almost the same barrel. The difference is really in the cut of the rifle bore.
If accuracy and bench use is the only concern, I see no reason to spend the extra money on the Wilson, as you'll likely get the same performance out of the WOA. You're getting decent components. I wouldn't so much go for RRA, but WOA is pretty decent. My brother's 16" WOA barrel is a tack driver.

As far as the twist rate, if your sole purpose is varmint hunting, where you will be shooting bullets 60gr or less in weight, the 1:12 is ideal. Varmint bullets are generally either a ballistic tip, JSP or HP design with a very thin copper jacket. Since the jackets are not very strong, they can actually rip right off if the bullet is going too fast and spins too much. This is primarily with the 40gr-52gr varmint bullets.
However, if you want long range precision for target shooting, you should be shooting a 68gr or heavier load. Preferable a 68, 69, 75 or 77gr BTHP/OTM match load. For all of these, you need that tighter 1:7 twist. For everything across the board, get the 1:7. You can varmint hunt with Hornady 75gr BTHPs and Sierra 69gr SMKs, but you shouldn't be doing 600yd precision shots with Hornady 40gr V-Max loads.
As usual, a most excellent and helpful post!
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