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Old 03-05-2013, 10:47 AM   #61
wildirish317
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Just to throw out a couple more things to check - torque converter and drive line bearings and joints between transmission and wheels. I really don't think it's a bearing problem though. Bearings would have to be in really rough shape to affect mpg, and you would hear them. Torque converter may be a culprit. What's your rpm @ 65 mph? I'm at 3,000. Also, plot your rpm vs. speed from 30 to 60 at several points. It should be a straight line. I have a manual, so I can't really speak to auto issues, but if you are not exactly half the speed at 1500 rpm as you are at 3000 rpm, the torque converter may be slipping. Just a thought.
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Old 03-05-2013, 10:50 AM   #62
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Originally Posted by ryannel2003 View Post
When I had the car set at 55 or 60MPH, it does about 34MPG but you basically can't touch the throttle at all and have to be a perfect driver. I did that once but it got boring so I went back up to 62MPH. I go by the dash read-out and I calculated it to be off by no more than 1MPG on my car.
That's great hopefully i can get my car up to there.
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Old 03-05-2013, 10:53 AM   #63
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Originally Posted by wildirish317 View Post
Just to throw out a couple more things to check - torque converter and drive line bearings and joints between transmission and wheels. I really don't think it's a bearing problem though. Bearings would have to be in really rough shape to affect mpg, and you would hear them. Torque converter may be a culprit. What's your rpm @ 65 mph? I'm at 3,000. Also, plot your rpm vs. speed from 30 to 60 at several points. It should be a straight line. I have a manual, so I can't really speak to auto issues, but if you are not exactly half the speed at 1500 rpm as you are at 3000 rpm, the torque converter may be slipping. Just a thought.
I will write it down when i drive today, yeah i don't think we can compare rpms with different transmissions.
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Old 03-05-2013, 11:23 AM   #64
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Originally Posted by gselsidi View Post
There are no codes. Tires have low rolling Resistance as they are not new and worn about 50%. The last owner told me he put new spark plugs, but when i get sometime I'm going to check them again. Yes on the 1/4 tank i got 40 miles avg speed of 25mph including the stop lights. If you take out the lights usually 30-40mph, short trips about 10mi.

I don't let my car warm up as it warms up faster driving. I never let my old one warm up either. One time though i warmed up my old car before driving and achieved the best mileage i had. Never really tried to duplicate it asi don't have time to wait 10min for it to warm up. I just ordered a adapter for torque

I have an Auto, seriously im not retarded i know how to calculate mpg i did it for 5 years straight with my old car. Weather is cold, i never noticed a huge difference in the mpg during summer or winter in my last car. Probably a less then 1mpg difference if that.

Will check tire pressure and calipers after i drive today.
No one here is implying that you're "retarded". We're just asking for specific data pieces to try and help you. Our assumptions are based on what you tell us or don't tell us. You say you drive like a "grandma". My mother is 79, drives a '97 Honda Accord with 4cyl-auto. She complains all the time about only getting 21 mpg. Yet when I test drove her car for a few days, I achieved 26 mpg. It's a matter of specific data vs vague statements. With all due respect, it seems you're only providing half the specifics, and only after some prodding, while still seeking answers to a supposed issue without any known codes.

The short trips of 10 miles are hurting you; your coolant barely gets to optimum temp. Driving 40 miles at 25 mph avg means you're doing quite a bit of stop-n-go driving. Guessing that you're stopped about 30-40% of the time just idling and getting 0 miles per gallon. No codes probably means your engine is operating optimally. Absent anything else that we don't know about, my guess is still your driving environment.
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Old 03-05-2013, 12:48 PM   #65
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No one here is implying that you're "retarded". We're just asking for specific data pieces to try and help you. Our assumptions are based on what you tell us or don't tell us. You say you drive like a "grandma". My mother is 79, drives a '97 Honda Accord with 4cyl-auto. She complains all the time about only getting 21 mpg. Yet when I test drove her car for a few days, I achieved 26 mpg. It's a matter of specific data vs vague statements. With all due respect, it seems you're only providing half the specifics, and only after some prodding, while still seeking answers to a supposed issue without any known codes.

The short trips of 10 miles are hurting you; your coolant barely gets to optimum temp. Driving 40 miles at 25 mph avg means you're doing quite a bit of stop-n-go driving. Guessing that you're stopped about 30-40% of the time just idling and getting 0 miles per gallon. No codes probably means your engine is operating optimally. Absent anything else that we don't know about, my guess is still your driving environment.
Clearly sort trips are hurting it but they shouldn't hurt to 10mpg, and there's no excuse for 25mpg purely highway driving.
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Old 03-05-2013, 01:07 PM   #66
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Need fuel trim and MAF data before you can complain about anything.

You will also NEED to spend a lot of money to find these last few MPG.

Just because there is no CEL does not mean there is not a problem. TRUST ME!!

The problem, if there is one, may be really hard to find.

TRUST ME, you will be into this at least $500 and you still may not get your end result.

So if you are not willing to take the time and pony up the money, live with it or sell the car.

Not trying to rain on the parade, but you should get together with a few of the other MPG complainers and see that they are reluctant to put their money where their complaint is!

Also you need to start to look at the 10,000 foot view and do a lot of research and reading to understand how the engine management systems works on late model cars.

5 things can be controlled on these engines, fuel delivery, ignition timing, cam timing, DISA and engine temperature. The hardest to nail down are the fuel delivery and VANOS.

Also keep in mind if you have an exhaust restriction you will have a hard time proving this other than getting an exhaust back pressure gauge and then the question becomes if you have only a small restriction, is the back pressure value for example 2 psi or 3 psi?? Likely no specs and you will likely need to measure and compare some of the 34 MPG cars that people claim exist!

Good luck, but you need to focus on your issue and not on what others claim in theses forum, you will likely get much further, if you even have a problem with poor fuel economy.
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Last edited by jfoj; 03-05-2013 at 03:34 PM.
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Old 03-05-2013, 01:23 PM   #67
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Going to post data when i get the torque adapter if nothing can be concluded from there will just take it to the dealer to diagnose.
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Old 03-05-2013, 02:09 PM   #68
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I usually ignore on fuel economy discussion unless it has a specific problem because they are done at uncontrolled environment lacking accuracy and repeatability. Winter fuel, road grade, traffic condition, wind speed, temperature, and ethanol content, to name a few, have significant effects on fuel economy. Click the fuel variations tab for impact of different fuel formulations. http://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/factors.shtml

However, I like to comment on a couple of things here.
1. Old vs new (2008) fuel economy number.
Older fuel economy number (pre 2008) overestimated than actual, and it was changed to reflect real world driving condition. See this article.
http://www.consumerreports.org/cro/c...709_mpg_ov.htm
Some auto manufacturer even had a specific calibration just for the drive cycle to get better number. It was kind of a cheating.

Quote:
Originally Posted by gselsidi View Post
Also for every car I've owned I've been able to get around 10-15% better on the old EPA estimates. The old estimates for this car are 27mpg highway, so 30 in my mind is def. achievable of course with my speed of 55mph tops.
I don't know how you achieved (verified?) better than older fuel economy number for your older cars, but I believe it is a pipe dream to do better than that in real consumer driving.
This is the 2005 325i comparison of the old and the new fuel economy numbers. The combined FE dropped about 10% to 20 mpg from 22.



It sure looks like your car fuel economy for 25 mpg on highway is right on the money.

This is our government site where our tax dollar is at work. It actually is a useful site.
http://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/calculatorSelectYear.jsp


2. 1/4 tank fuel economy calculation.
If you eyeballed the ¼ tank usage based on the fuel gauge needle, you are way off for the used fuel quantity. First, how accurate is your eye-ball gauge measuring the needle and thick indicators? Second, if you calculate the amount of fuel used in the following way, then it is overestimated. Say 16 gallons full tank divided by 4 equals 4 gallons used. Empty "E" line still has about 2 gallons reserved. I can not vouch the number since I have not emptied the tank to measure it after the needle was at E. But that's how most auto manufacturers design the tank and fuel indicator to save the day for the people who routinely drive down to Empty tank. You can try by driving down to E and fill it up to see how many gallons it will take and compare with fuel tank volume spec.

Once you receive the scanner, log your normal driving and plot out like this.
http://forum.e46fanatics.com/showthr...=966296&page=6

If your engine operating temperature is normal (matter of fact, you said it is normal after T-stat replacement) and LTFT & STFT are within +/- 5% (my arbitrary numbers) at steady vehicle speed, then your engine is in good working order and call it a day. And enjoy driving BMW like it was meant to be driven instead of driving like a grandma.

If you are obsessed with fuel economy, trade your BMW to get a Prius and join the hypermilling club. You will have, at least, a joy achieving the bragging fuel economy and saving the earth for future generation at the same time instead of torturing your BMW to crawl.

Last edited by dslboomer; 03-08-2013 at 02:38 AM.
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Old 03-06-2013, 11:59 AM   #69
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Don't want to save the earth don't want lambo mpg with bmw stock hp either lol. I will collect the data soon.

I checked the gas tank same values but the guage moves lower each time. Also, it just seems screwy in its movement it will not move at all for 20min then it just takes a dive.

Checked calipers they were not warm or hot, tire pressure was ok.

My rpm at 60mph was 2200ish
At 65mph it was around 2400ish
Depending on the throttle load, but near those numbers at constant throttle. I have noticed the transmission acta bit screwy sometimes. It downshifts randomly at times, usually slowing or accelerating when elevation comes into play.

Last edited by gselsidi; 03-06-2013 at 02:04 PM.
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Old 03-06-2013, 03:16 PM   #70
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I'm getting 18/25 with a heavy foot & a manual tranny
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Old 03-11-2013, 11:27 PM   #71
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Just went down south for 500 miles each way. Doing 65-80mpg the whole way avg. probably 75ish and got 31.20mpg dafuk??!! Will check mileage again on my normal routine. BTW I changed my front left tire as it was causing the car to pull hard left, but I doubt that would cause a 6mpg difference??

Anyway got my Bluetooth adapter, tried to play with it today but couldn't really get it to work with torque will try again later and then post some data.
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Old 03-11-2013, 11:59 PM   #72
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If youre having the issue where torque keeps closing out on you, try uninstalling then installing an older version, like 1.5x where x can be any variation of number or numbers.
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Old 03-12-2013, 12:10 AM   #73
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Got it to work will set it up tomorrow on my drive. Can someone provide a list of graphs I should set up? As I saw a bunch of options for each. For example fuel trims has like 10 different options, Oxygen sensors the same thing.

Thanks.
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Old 03-12-2013, 12:27 AM   #74
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Just went down south for 500 miles each way. Doing 65-80mpg the whole way avg. probably 75ish and got 31.20mpg dafuk??!! Will check mileage again on my normal routine. BTW I changed my front left tire as it was causing the car to pull hard left, but I doubt that would cause a 6mpg difference??
Sounds like your car is operating optimally. Interesting about the the left front tire. I didn't think to ask you about the alignment; I know being out of alignment can affect mpg. Glad to hear you're getting some decent mpg though.
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Old 03-12-2013, 12:45 AM   #75
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Sounds like your car is operating optimally. Interesting about the the left front tire. I didn't think to ask you about the alignment; I know being out of alignment can affect mpg. Glad to hear you're getting some decent mpg though.
Idk hopefully it continues i hope optimally on this car doesn't require long drives lol. Well on another topic going to set up an appointment to the dealer my gas tank now cuts off fairly often when filling up, have to turn the pump upside down sometimes to pump gas.

Being this is a SULEV free gas tank lol, will try to get my torque converter covered too. I will post mpg numbers again then i will be able to tell how much the tires helped.

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Old 03-12-2013, 01:25 AM   #76
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You're getting on average what everybody else averages. I'm afraid to say this but definitely don't go blowing a whole lot on what would eventually be no more than a couple of mpg regained if that. Glad youre on the hunt though. If you so discoversomething i may even try it myself
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Old 03-12-2013, 10:07 AM   #77
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I am extremely happy with what i got at those speeds. Now will compare what i get on my normal drive, but def am not going to spend allot of moneyto try and make it better than it is lol
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Old 03-12-2013, 10:35 AM   #78
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Op is chasing the dragon. But maybe its worth it if the parts are warrantied.

sent from my ATARI sc1224
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Old 03-12-2013, 10:36 AM   #79
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Op is chasing the dragon. But maybe its worth it if the parts are warrantied.

sent from my ATARI sc1224
I will slay this magical dragon!
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Old 03-12-2013, 09:03 PM   #80
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well it seems like I'm back to my normal mpg I haven't checked yet but where my mileage is on the 1/4 line I can tell my mpg at the end of the tank is going to end 20-25mpg.

I monitored fuel trims and it never went above 5%, AFR was around 14ish.

My commute each way is about 12.5 miles, could driving that little make that big of a difference in MPG? I mean it takes me about 20min to reach my destination, it should take the car about 10min to reach proper temperature correct?

I mean during that long highway trip I drove with an avg speed of about 75mph and I got 31mpg

Now avg speed of 50 and I'm getting around low 20's, If I drove that long trip at lower speeds I would estimate getting around 39mpg according to this http://www.mpgforspeed.com/

So is it possible that short distance driving could yield about a 50% drop in fuel economy? How long does it take the care to warm up to efficient operating temps? Even if it hits 95C coolant temp, I'm assuming it's still not operating efficiently since I hit those temps about 5min into my drive.

Any thoughts? Or scientific explanations?
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