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Old 03-20-2013, 08:07 PM   #21
lcoleman
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This is a car that, uh, looks a lot like mine. Chase car is a good friend in his NA Miata with AST 4100s, 15x9s with 225 RS3s, yadda yadda. He's faster than I am.

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Old 03-20-2013, 08:17 PM   #22
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Disagree. The dragon will test not only your knowledge of your vehicle, but it will also test your limit, and your balls/limit ratio, something a track can't teach you. I am FAR more exuberant on an auto-x than I am on the dragon.
That makes sense. Auto-x is slower and the risk are lower. However, on a track you can crash in spectacular fashion. I don't see how that isn't testing your "balls/limit ratio."
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Old 03-20-2013, 08:20 PM   #23
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That makes sense. Auto-x is slower and the risk are lower. However, on a track you can crash in spectacular fashion. I don't see how that isn't testing your "balls/limit ratio."
On a track yes, you can crash and pretty badly, but add another element...this is a public road. There are leaves, gravel, cracks, etc on this road. We had one guy fly off a cliff a few years back because there was some loose gravel on a corner. I agree, a track is exciting, but I've never had a more white knuckle drive than driving 8/10s on the dragon...I can't imagine 10/10nths.
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Old 03-20-2013, 09:41 PM   #24
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And on a track you can get dirt, gravel, oil, leaves, grass...it's a road just like any other road, just no oncoming traffic. I'm not saying that pushing the car on the edge of a cliff is less exciting than pushing it on the track, but actually learning about how your car reacts at speed and understanding car control happens a lot faster in a controlled environment. I grew up driving back roads and still love getting out in the country, but I know I learned 1000x more through auto-x, skid pads, and HPDEs than I ever did in the multiple occasions when I nearly wrecked on a public road by pushing it too far.
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Old 03-20-2013, 10:16 PM   #25
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Disagree. The dragon will test not only your knowledge of your vehicle, but it will also test your limit, and your balls/limit ratio, something a track can't teach you. I am FAR more exuberant on an auto-x than I am on the dragon. There is one guy in our group that no one, regardless of car can touch. Sure, there are faster cars than an s2000 on the dragon, but no one has the balls like him to drive at 11/10ths on the road. This guy talked A LOT of sh!t, and even after he crashed he was talking smack...almost like "dude I almost had you" when he claimed he can keep up with Bill (the guy Im referring to in my post.)



Here is a video of him running the dragon. Dragon starts at 13:40



The exhaust sounds like sh!t because one of the muffler's internals blew out.
That guy is absolutely nuts but the car sounds great when he gets on it. And was that a cop he passed at 29:20?
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Old 03-20-2013, 10:19 PM   #26
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That guy is absolutely nuts but the car sounds great when he gets on it. And was that a cop he passed at 29:20?
Yea, the cop pulled over some guys (in a civic and something else) that were doing mini drifts and constantly crossing the yellow lines. The cops generally leave our s2000 convoy alone. We've been coming there for over 10 years as a group, and are respectful of the road, bring a heap of money to the area, so they don't really bother us. They go after the tards that are trying to keep up, and causing dangerous situations in the process.
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Old 03-20-2013, 10:34 PM   #27
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Yea, the cop pulled over some guys (in a civic and something else) that were doing mini drifts and constantly crossing the yellow lines. The cops generally leave our s2000 convoy alone. We've been coming there for over 10 years as a group, and are respectful of the road, bring a heap of money to the area, so they don't really bother us. They go after the tards that are trying to keep up, and causing dangerous situations in the process.
That's nice of the cops but seems so foreign to me, given that he was flying around the corner. I guess they're used to this type of traffic
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Old 03-20-2013, 10:38 PM   #28
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That's nice of the cops but seems so foreign to me, given that he was flying around the corner. I guess they're used to this type of traffic
The entire economy of that area relies solely on sports cars and bikes coming down there and doing what they do. So long as you don't do anything stupid and reckless, they leave you alone. Another thing is that the dragon is a jurisdictional dead end. One side is in TN and the other is in NC. As a result, cops from each state can only enter from one side (their respective sides) and can be easily counted, spotted, and tracked.
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Old 03-20-2013, 10:41 PM   #29
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That guy is absolutely nuts but the car sounds great when he gets on it. And was that a cop he passed at 29:20?
lol yeah i coulda sworn the cop had his radar gun pointed with his door open...nuts. starting at 16:00 and 25:00 this Billy guy was a thrill to watch!!! used every inch of asphalt.
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Old 03-20-2013, 10:42 PM   #30
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^^^ Exactly what he said. Awesome road, lucky enough to live by it, and the place seems to bring out the responsibility of most people. Mature crowds tend to always be there, surprisingly.
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Old 03-20-2013, 10:48 PM   #31
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lol yeah i coulda sworn the cop had his radar gun pointed with his door open...nuts. starting at 16:00 and 25:00 this Billy guy was a thrill to watch!!! used every inch of asphalt.
He did had his radar out, but we later found out he went after the civic.

As for the driving...only 3 people in the history of our drive down there have been able to sit in his passenger seat for the entire run and not empty their stomachs.

Thats the thing about the dragon, there is no reset button....one wrong move, and your car is toast.
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Old 03-20-2013, 10:52 PM   #32
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As for the driving...only 3 people in the history of our drive down there have been able to sit in his passenger seat for the entire run and not empty their stomachs.
I would TOTALLY be up for this ride. And his car was a 350Z, no? the door handle looked like a Z...it was an S2K?
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Old 03-20-2013, 10:55 PM   #33
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I would TOTALLY be up for this ride. And his car was a 350Z, no? the door handle looked like a Z...it was an S2K?
s2k. 350z's are pretty slow on the dragon. 370z's are a bit better. The best dragon cars are s2k's, miatas, MR2s, minicoopers, elise's, etc. Fatties like the 350z are just too heavy to toss around those tight bends. Not saying they are "slow" but they can't keep up with the lightweight go-cart sports cars.


Oh, and I must confess, I am not one of those 3.
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Old 03-20-2013, 11:53 PM   #34
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Huge difference between balls/limit ratio and balls/stupidity ratio. Many, many people run out of talent before they run out of courage, and to put other cars and oncoming traffic at risk is totally uncalled for. Race tracks are made for racing, public roads are not.

As someone who races every day of his life, I 100% disagree that you can see how good of a driver you are on the dragon. The fastest guy is going to be the one that puts everyone at risk in the hopes of going faster than the extremely talented driver who isn't willing to kill someone else on a public road.

So, if you want to tell your buddy that no one can touch, regardless of car, to come to an autocross, I'll happily race him where I know I can safely push my car to the limit. On the dragon, sure, he can "win." I'll go have a good time and enjoy the view and not kill anyone in the process. Cheers.
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Old 03-20-2013, 11:54 PM   #35
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When I went there about 10 years ago with a Porsche 944 turbo, it showed me how awful of a driver I really am. I went with a group of people, all sorts of different cars, Mustang, Eagle Talon AWD, Ford Probe, and a Lexus SC400. The Talon was the fastest out of our group, and the Lexus was left waaaaaaaay behind.
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Old 03-21-2013, 12:21 AM   #36
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s2k. 350z's are pretty slow on the dragon. 370z's are a bit better. The best dragon cars are s2k's, miatas, MR2s, minicoopers, elise's, etc. Fatties like the 350z are just too heavy to toss around those tight bends. Not saying they are "slow" but they can't keep up with the lightweight go-cart sports cars.
I know a 350Z owner (actually, ex-owner) who was faster than pretty much everybody but the Gap Jedi...search that on Facebook. FD, old-time local; he's sub 10 minutes from state line to overlook.

Not trying to start sh!t or anything, just pointing out that you're completely wrong. Power and square 275s will overcome a lot of weight disadvantage. To be fair, however, most Z drivers are d-bags. I refuse to participate in ZDayz any more because I was almost in a crash in my e46 a couple of years ago.

I think your S2K guy is pretty sloppy, too, for the record. That angle makes him look fast, but he doesn't even go into 3rd. Jerky inputs, etc. Probably why people are puking, lol.

Despite my (and others') questionable judgment, everyone in this thread is absolutely correct. It is not safe, and probably flat-out unwise. My "group" pretty much stopped going before dusk...at least we're not endangering anyone else at night.
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Old 03-21-2013, 01:10 AM   #37
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I know a 350Z owner (actually, ex-owner) who was faster than pretty much everybody but the Gap Jedi...search that on Facebook. FD, old-time local; he's sub 10 minutes from state line to overlook.

Not trying to start sh!t or anything, just pointing out that you're completely wrong. Power and square 275s will overcome a lot of weight disadvantage. To be fair, however, most Z drivers are d-bags. I refuse to participate in ZDayz any more because I was almost in a crash in my e46 a couple of years ago.

I think your S2K guy is pretty sloppy, too, for the record. That angle makes him look fast, but he doesn't even go into 3rd. Jerky inputs, etc. Probably why people are puking, lol.

Despite my (and others') questionable judgment, everyone in this thread is absolutely correct. It is not safe, and probably flat-out unwise. My "group" pretty much stopped going before dusk...at least we're not endangering anyone else at night.
He is the furthest thing from sloppy. He stays next to the white line more than anyone I have ever seen. The only reason he went around those two cars is because they were pulling over in an area where they were not supposed to, and there was no oncoming traffic. As for not switching over to 3rd, the s2000 gets to about 58mph in 2nd. Shifting to third on the dragon would actually make you slower, with the exception of a few areas where you can hear him shift to 3rd. The jerky inputs are the nature of the s2000. Lightning quick steering and incredibly tight turns (if you have ever been to the dragon as a passenger you should know) To each their own. I've been in the racing and sports car game for a LONG time, and I have never see a driver better than him. I have no dog in the fight. It's not I that is claiming to be the best. Are there better drivers? Probably. Have I ever seen better driving and car control? Not even close. I've said in other threads, if you can maintain 40mph (most can't) on the dragon, you can consider yourself a good driver and you know your car. If you can do 50-60, thats surgical.
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Old 03-21-2013, 01:11 AM   #38
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Old 03-21-2013, 01:31 AM   #39
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I've said in other threads, if you can maintain 40mph (most can't) on the dragon, you can consider yourself a good driver and you know your car. If you can do 50-60, thats surgical.
I was keeping it around 30-35 myself. I don't know the road that well yet
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Old 03-21-2013, 02:14 AM   #40
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