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Go Back   E46Fanatics > Tuning & Tech > Driveline, Engine & DME Tuning

Driveline, Engine & DME Tuning
Talk about driveline improvements, NA tuning and DME tuning your E46 BMW here. This includes diffs, intakes, exhausts, chips, software and OBD tuning.

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Old 07-14-2013, 01:00 PM   #1
daniel_f.
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Goal: S50B30 figures at M54B30?

hello guys,

advice is needed this time: as im having the zf5hp19 auto, im limited in torque to around 330-340Nm. therefore, and some other things, i dont want the car to be charged in any kind of way.

the car is pretty heavy as its a convertible with full option and even heavier with the LPG unit. so im on the search for a little more ooomph

as i really like NA engines, i would like to ask the more professional guys here: what is needed to achieve ~280-290PS (crank!)

i know i could buy a wrecked m3 and change the engine and all that stuff, but thats just to simple of a mod and even totally wrecked m3s are expensive as hell!

i would like to add a list of mods which i have thought about, maybe someone with real experience can chime in and give me a hint
  • injectors are rated to ~260hp, raising the pressure should be ok?!
  • bigger throttle with 25% more square area
  • intake 264 10,5mm / exhaust 252 10mm
  • supersprint headers
  • underfloor cats from uk e46 instead of first silencer
  • head done by my engine pro
  • raised compression (low cost hints are welcome), 11:1?
  • ?

what do you think?

changing the gearbox is a no-go as im definately stick with the auto, it should hold the torque, it has 20k miles on it.
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Old 07-14-2013, 02:13 PM   #2
SoloII///M
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Check the dyno plot thread. There are a few cars making 230hp at the wheels on an M54, which translates into 270bhp+ at the crank. It all comes down to having the right tuning.
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Old 07-14-2013, 07:01 PM   #3
TerraPhantm
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Can you get your hands on an S50b30? I don't think you'll get 280-290 out of an M54 without spending a lot of money. The head just doesn't flow that well.
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Old 07-15-2013, 06:02 AM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by daniel_f. View Post
hello guys,


the car is pretty heavy as its a convertible with full option and even heavier with the LPG unit. so im on the search for a little more ooomph

as i really like NA engines, i would like to ask the more professional guys here: what is needed to achieve ~280-290PS (crank!)

i know i could buy a wrecked m3 and change the engine and all that stuff, but thats just to simple of a mod and even totally wrecked m3s are expensive as hell!
.
Hello my friend in still occupied vaterland. I totally understand you, there is no freedom in new Germany when it comes to modding cars. Laws are much more stricter than USA. Some European laws don't even let you change the engine for another one, you have to work with your original block. If the block is beyond repair, you can only buy a new one from manufacturer, you can't buy one from the junk yard. Also in Germany salvage yards are also under big political pressure.

Here in the USA we have racing fuel VP117 that could tolerate compression ratio of 14:1. That would put you at 330 horsepower. On naturally aspirated engine you got to raise the compression ratio to make more power. Pump fuel does not have ability to suppress the detonation there for you are limited to what ever maximum power you can get now. #1 reason why S54 makes 333hp is because of the 11.5:1 compression ratio. And is able to deal with preventing detonation from premium pump fuel by using superior piston crown design, variable dual camshafts that constantly adjust and not like M54 is only on/off camshaft design.
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Old 07-15-2013, 06:11 AM   #5
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I disagree. The biggest reason the S54 makes 333hp is because it can breathe and safely rev to 8,000+ RPM. The M54 can't safely rev that high in anything resembling stock form and the head doesn't flow enough up there anyway.

Not sure what you mean about the M54 being an "on / off" camshaft adjustment. The phasing of them is able to be constantly adjusted - we played with this on the dyno a ton this past weekend.

John
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Old 07-15-2013, 08:52 AM   #6
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Originally Posted by SoloII///M View Post
I disagree. The biggest reason the S54 makes 333hp is because it can breathe and safely rev to 8,000+ RPM. The M54 can't safely rev that high in anything resembling stock form and the head doesn't flow enough up there anyway.

Not sure what you mean about the M54 being an "on / off" camshaft adjustment. The phasing of them is able to be constantly adjusted - we played with this on the dyno a ton this past weekend.

John
And we are all waiting for you results!
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Old 07-15-2013, 09:55 AM   #7
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And we are all waiting for you results!
They've been posted.
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Old 07-15-2013, 10:01 AM   #8
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Ah I see that now, didn't even see that the dyno thread had been bumped up. Do you have any dyno's from before you bored the m50 throttle body?
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Old 07-15-2013, 10:06 AM   #9
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Originally Posted by SoloII///M View Post
Check the dyno plot thread. There are a few cars making 230bhp at the wheels on an M54, which translates into 270bhp+ at the crank. It all comes down to having the right tuning.
Brake horsepower at the wheels? Interesting.

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Old 07-15-2013, 10:11 AM   #10
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typo
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Old 07-15-2013, 10:19 AM   #11
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Ah I see that now, didn't even see that the dyno thread had been bumped up. Do you have any dyno's from before you bored the m50 throttle body?
No. The only dyno runs I have prior to this one were with a tuned MS43 DME running the stock 68mm E-throttle. The tuning was done by Technica and the car made 218whp peak but the torque was way down in the midrange.

For the Megasquirt we did a 90% tune on gas (well... E10 really) but spent most of our time on the E85 tune.
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Old 07-15-2013, 02:51 PM   #12
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Originally Posted by daniel_f. View Post
hello guys,

advice is needed this time: as im having the zf5hp19 auto, im limited in torque to around 330-340Nm. therefore, and some other things, i dont want the car to be charged in any kind of way.

the car is pretty heavy as its a convertible with full option and even heavier with the LPG unit. so im on the search for a little more ooomph

as i really like NA engines, i would like to ask the more professional guys here: what is needed to achieve ~280-290PS (crank!)

i know i could buy a wrecked m3 and change the engine and all that stuff, but thats just to simple of a mod and even totally wrecked m3s are expensive as hell!

i would like to add a list of mods which i have thought about, maybe someone with real experience can chime in and give me a hint
  • injectors are rated to ~260hp, raising the pressure should be ok?! Yes. Currently your 330 is at 3.5 BAR, this can be raised to 5.0 BAR.
  • bigger throttle with 25% more square area. That seems like a HUGE jump, if you can get a Dinan or Bored out stock TB (Big Bore TB) that will work perfectly. Remember, it's not the TB that is the restriction: It's the HEAD.
  • intake 264 10,5mm / exhaust 252 10mm Yes.
  • supersprint headers. Expensive, if you can buy a "Copy" or Ebay / Bimmerbrakes, they will work just as well.
  • underfloor cats from uk e46 instead of first silencer. Headers with No cats would be best. If you need a cat, consider the Magnaflow 94038, it's easily fitted with little modification. Also you could easily design it to be removable, you would put a straight pipe in it's place.
  • head done by my engine pro. Yes. Porting both intake & exhaust ports, port match both in. & ex., grind off the valve guide that comes through into the port (both in. & ex.), and if you can afford 1mm larger intake valves, buy them.
  • raised compression (low cost hints are welcome), 11:1? Yes. You could deck the block or head, or both. The key to this would be to calculate your current piston to valve clearance.
  • ? Under Drive Pulleys, Titanium valve retainers, CAI that's Really getting cool/cold ram air, and some sort of "Tune" after everything is added; preferably a custom tune (7000-7200RPM) while on a dyno.

what do you think?

changing the gearbox is a no-go as im definately stick with the auto, it should hold the torque, it has 20k miles on it.


The head & cams are your Biggest HP makers, make sure your motor builder pulls out all the tricks for your head porting.

Picture of the Magnaflow #94038 Cat. The center hole gets plugged, & two new 02 bungs are welded in on each side.
http://www.magnaflow.com/02catalytic...niversal=94038
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SUMMIT POINT WV 1:24:229 S.C.C.A.
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Nitrous is a little trickier than boost, but it's not the spray that kills motors, it's STUPIDITY!!

Last edited by Rob43; 07-15-2013 at 05:54 PM.
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Old 07-31-2013, 06:54 AM   #13
daniel_f.
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i can get a new set of cams 264/252 for 350€. im undecided wether i should buy them or not... any input is welcome
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Old 07-31-2013, 02:14 PM   #14
Rob43
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Yes, buy them.

I also run 264/252 cams in my M54B30, they work well.
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Rob #43 ITS/ITR/STU, BMW 325I, STU LAP RECORD
SUMMIT POINT WV 1:24:229 S.C.C.A.
(DynoDynamics Dyno Video)
"Chance Favors The Prepared Mind"

Need Help With Your Nitrous Ambitions ?.....PM ME
Quote:
Originally Posted by RacerX View Post
Nitrous is a little trickier than boost, but it's not the spray that kills motors, it's STUPIDITY!!
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Old 07-31-2013, 02:25 PM   #15
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I want to see that dyno.
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Old 07-31-2013, 02:31 PM   #16
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I would not regularly rev an M54B30 to greater than 7,000 RPM. Even with an upgraded front balancer, a stock flywheel, a balanced rotating assembly, etc. Not a wise idea.
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Old 07-31-2013, 02:58 PM   #17
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I want to see that dyno.

Who are you directing this statement at ?
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Rob #43 ITS/ITR/STU, BMW 325I, STU LAP RECORD
SUMMIT POINT WV 1:24:229 S.C.C.A.
(DynoDynamics Dyno Video)
"Chance Favors The Prepared Mind"

Need Help With Your Nitrous Ambitions ?.....PM ME
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Originally Posted by RacerX View Post
Nitrous is a little trickier than boost, but it's not the spray that kills motors, it's STUPIDITY!!
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Old 07-31-2013, 07:20 PM   #18
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Who are you directing this statement at ?
You of course man.
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Old 07-31-2013, 09:39 PM   #19
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I hear ya.

My last dyno (DynoDynamics) which was Quite awhile ago came in at 215WHP, the conversion from my dyno to a Dynojet would put me at 244WHP or 288BHP. I was not happy with these numbers at the time, based on the fact that the car had sat for awhile so the battery was dead & the fuel was stale.

At that time it also lacked:

1) Maxbore TB (Bigbore)
2) Burns 3" Merge Collector
3) Custom 3" Cat-Back with 3" Cutout
4) Custom Long Tube CAI with Venturi Air Filter
5) D-Force LTW5 Wheels For A 26lbs Weight
Savings & 1.5% Better (235 Tires) Gearing
6) Turner Motorsports FPR, For Manual AFR Tuning
7) A Custom Dyno Tune To 7200 RPM

I'd like to see 20 plus WHP from all these mods, we'll see. I will post up that dyno when it's all done; It will be a Dynojet with CF SAE.
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Rob #43 ITS/ITR/STU, BMW 325I, STU LAP RECORD
SUMMIT POINT WV 1:24:229 S.C.C.A.
(DynoDynamics Dyno Video)
"Chance Favors The Prepared Mind"

Need Help With Your Nitrous Ambitions ?.....PM ME
Quote:
Originally Posted by RacerX View Post
Nitrous is a little trickier than boost, but it's not the spray that kills motors, it's STUPIDITY!!

Last edited by Rob43; 08-01-2013 at 03:54 PM.
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Old 08-22-2013, 07:07 PM   #20
partyvi
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I realize this is an old thread, but AFR did come up with a formula for calculating the most power you can get out of a head:

HP = 0.25714 x CFM @28" H20 x No. of cylinders

Assuming the head on the M54B30 flows 204.8cfm at max lift I'm assuming the most you will see out of this engine without head work is 315hp. Again, this is assuming you bolt on everything you can, cam it, raise compression, etc. Just food for thought.
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