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The BMW E46 ///M3 is the M version E46 and puts out an amazing 333 HP and 262 lb-ft of torque at stock specs! There are an amazing amount of modifications for both the coupe and convertible models so read up and get started modifying your cars today!

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Old 01-27-2009, 09:52 PM   #21
plaroud
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BrisM3 View Post
Why do you use 15w-50 oil instead of the 10w-60?

Not hassling just curious.

Cheers.
I use the same oil, mobil 1 15w-50. In the winter I add some 5w30. Car runs so much smoother and I dont burn oil every 1,000 like others.
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Old 01-27-2009, 10:01 PM   #22
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Originally Posted by braymond141 View Post
Goodluck with all that.

To the rest, stick with your TWS 10w60. It's the best stuff around for your M3.
TWS 10w60 sucks, I have been using mobil 1 15w50 just like the OP (excluding the additive) and have been very happy with it. I track my car at least 10 times a year and I have owned it for 5 years. In the summer the oil levels stay cooler with the mobil 1. My cousin also has over 120,000 miles on his 2001 M5 and beats the crap out of it and uses 10w40.

Don't believe everything that BMW recommends. As long as you change it often it should be fine. fully synthetic oil is pretty much all the same and the viscocity between those 2 oils are almost the same. Castrol doesnt put anything magical in their TWS 10w60 so relax.
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Old 01-27-2009, 10:03 PM   #23
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Originally Posted by rodneyrjr View Post
I change my oil consistently every 4000 miles. It comes out so clean I am almost temPted to put it in my truck.(LOL)

The MOBIL 1 FULL SYNTHETIC 15W-50 is a very high rated oil.
Go to MOBIL website and you can get the specs and read for yourself.

I have also used different types of oil and sent samples to BLACKSTONE LABS for testing. You can find them oN Google.

Its funny that BMW has a problem with there cars, together with castrol they come up with the 10w-60 and what there is no other oil thats good enough for BMW.

Ferrari and Corvette use MOBIL 1 FROM THE FACTORY- no engine recalls going on in that market.
Porsche also uses mobil 1 15w50 from the factory
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Old 02-19-2009, 03:25 PM   #24
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I agree about Lucas products, very superior in my opinion.
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Old 02-19-2009, 04:09 PM   #25
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Old 02-19-2009, 04:31 PM   #26
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Originally Posted by plaroud View Post
TWS 10w60 sucks, I have been using mobil 1 15w50 just like the OP (excluding the additive) and have been very happy with it. I track my car at least 10 times a year and I have owned it for 5 years. In the summer the oil levels stay cooler with the mobil 1. My cousin also has over 120,000 miles on his 2001 M5 and beats the crap out of it and uses 10w40.

Don't believe everything that BMW recommends. As long as you change it often it should be fine. fully synthetic oil is pretty much all the same and the viscocity between those 2 oils are almost the same. Castrol doesnt put anything magical in their TWS 10w60 so relax.
I don't use TWS 10w60 either and think it's a waste of money, and 15,000 miles is insane! I don't care what BMW suggests; I'm not going to run dirty oil in my car. I use Mobil 1 15w50 and change my own oil; mine doesn't burn any oil... When I purchased my M, I called in Independant shop that specializes in BMW, and they don't even use the 10w60 oil, they use Mobil 1.
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Old 02-19-2009, 04:42 PM   #27
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Castrol TWS 10W-60 is overrated. ( I personally hate Castrol, the quality of oil isn't that great ). But you must get the viscosity right. I use ELF 10w-50 as it falls into the requirements of BMWs standards. Love it!
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Old 02-19-2009, 04:50 PM   #28
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01 M3 Vert. Change my oil every 15kmi (as recommended by BMW), but i do change my oil filter every 7.5kmi. Motor oil, especially synth, is far superior to what our parents were used to. BMW 15kmi recommendation has already plenty of buffer added to it. The oil filter has been and remain paper. It is now the weakest link. Changing your oil every 3 or 4kmi shows that you don't understand the advance in technology that has taken place. Synth to dyno oil is like Intel's Quad core to a 486.
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Old 02-19-2009, 04:56 PM   #29
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Originally Posted by robbieracer View Post
I don't use TWS 10w60 either and think it's a waste of money, and 15,000 miles is insane! I don't care what BMW suggests; I'm not going to run dirty oil in my car. I use Mobil 1 15w50 and change my own oil; mine doesn't burn any oil... When I purchased my M, I called in Independant shop that specializes in BMW, and they don't even use the 10w60 oil, they use Mobil 1.
Using the recommended oil and weight is insane?!?!
I agree that changing your oil more often than recommended can not hurt your engine (but will the environment). But completely dismissing all BMW recommendations is crazy.

What's insane is thinking that you can come up with a better product than Castrol 10W60 by chance or by trials. What lab does your research for you?

Last edited by tilolite; 02-19-2009 at 04:59 PM.
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Old 02-19-2009, 05:37 PM   #30
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I think the 10W-60 oil was an initial band aid BMW applied to the then burgeoning rod bearing problem which I think BMW hoped would forestall the full out rod bearing recall that was eventually done. The real issue was found to be under spec rod bearings. Of course, after issuing the call for 10W-60, they couldn't very well turn around and say, "sorry folks, seems we guessed wrong on that one," especially realizing they had inadvertently created a small oil monopoly (guess where the only easy source of the TWS is? That's right, BMW dealerships).

Of course, the TWS oil IS very good oil and you certainly wouldn't go wrong using it. But is it "necessary" to keep your S54 from fragging, after, presumably, you had the root rod bearing problem fixed? I would suggest not, especially given that very similarly stressed motors (Honda 2000, various Ferraris, innumerable turbo motors...) seem to survive just fine on Mobil One class swill.

Or are we to assume that the S54 is somehow under engineered for its designed operating limits and duties?
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Old 02-19-2009, 06:31 PM   #31
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"Every" car forum has these same emotional threads where many get on their soapbox and bloviate the goodness of this oil and that oil. Guys, we have chosen to purchase an extremely awesome (and expensive) engine, with an awesome car wrapped around it. Each owner needs to evaluate what "works" for them. Using Blackstone as proof for oil decisions is always a good thing. This is proof of what is going on inside your engine. Those that understand the results from the analysis can make an informed decision on what is best for them. For the rest of us though, it seems to me that using the recommended TWS 10W-60 oil at 7.5K intervals is good insurance. For those that think this oil is overpriced: what part of this car isn't expensive to maintain? If you are on a tight budget, maybe you shouldn't own one. If you have found a different oil combination that works for you, great, but I will stick to TWS 10W-60 cause I like to splurge on my baby...

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Old 02-19-2009, 07:20 PM   #32
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So is there a difference between TWS and TWS motorsports besides the packaging? They are both rated at 10w60...
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Old 02-19-2009, 10:22 PM   #33
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Here's an interesting thread on TWS 10w-60 on the BITOG (Bob Is The Oil Guy) forum: http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums...56#Post1353856. All of the comments support the idea that TWS is a very, very good oil, particularly in its application in the m3 (more or less tailor-made by BMW/Castrol for the S54), and has a very advanced anti-wear package. Some of the posts from an Aussie who works in the lubrication industry (Exxon/Mobil, I think ) seemed to imply that TWS is a descendant of Castrol R and may contain some castor oil in its formulation. A separate post, also on BITOG, showed data from a German BMW forum comparing film strength of various oils. The TWS film strength, measured in kg/cm (whatever that is), was three to four times that of similar 15w-50 and 10w-60 oils, and almost as good as Motul 300V 15w-60, an ester-based racing oil.
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Old 02-20-2009, 07:49 AM   #34
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Originally Posted by tilolite View Post
Using the recommended oil and weight is insane?!?!
I agree that changing your oil more often than recommended can not hurt your engine (but will the environment). But completely dismissing all BMW recommendations is crazy.

What's insane is thinking that you can come up with a better product than Castrol 10W60 by chance or by trials. What lab does your research for you?
This can be debated forever has it has already been done on another post. I didn't say using the recommended oil and weight is insane! I said changing your oil every 15,000 miles is insane... I've read technical reviews about Castrol and it wasn't among the top oils, it isn't as good of oil some others; namely Mobil 1. I'm sure their 10w60 formula fine, but I'm not going to use it. I prefer Mobil 1 and it's half the cost. Now will these extended formulas hold up to 15,000 miles, I'm sure they will since they're designed that way, but oil breaks down and gets more dirty everytime you drive and I can garuantee that at 15,000 it's very dirty oil. Bottom line is you gotta do what makes you happy/comfortable and I'm not comfortable changing my oil at 15,000 miles, so I'll change mine at 7,000.
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Last edited by robbieracer; 02-20-2009 at 07:57 AM.
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Old 02-20-2009, 09:39 AM   #35
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Some very good information in this thread.. I think a poll should be added if possible.

_Zach_
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Old 02-20-2009, 10:22 AM   #36
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Originally Posted by M3_DU View Post
Castrol TWS 10W-60 is overrated. ( I personally hate Castrol, the quality of oil isn't that great ). But you must get the viscosity right. I use ELF 10w-50 as it falls into the requirements of BMWs standards. Love it!
elf makes a 10w60 FYI
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Old 02-20-2009, 06:03 PM   #37
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eh, i'll just stick to what is recommended for the car even of if its a little more costly
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Old 02-21-2009, 10:07 AM   #38
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eh, i'll just stick to what is recommended for the car even of if its a little more costly
I agree. I'm no scientist, so I am not going to butt heads with the manufacturer of the car with what is best for it. Those guys are German engineers and scientists in some cases, who here on the forum has credentials to contest them? No one here I'm sure. Running the recommended oil is cheap insurance on a $20K new engine replacement. But then again, when its your car, you can run whatever you want really!


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Old 05-03-2010, 09:20 PM   #39
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It's all about the money. If BMW says for you to only use Castrol, then most of you will use it. Guess who wins? BMW and Castrol. I would like someone to show me a case where using Valvoline 5W-30 Synpower is worse then using TWS 10W-60 in the past few years. Show me someone who has blown up there engine and I will be a believer of 10W-60. Until then I will just stick to changing my 5W-30 every 6,000 miles.

You guys can stick with your cheap insurance, but I bet you money my engine will last just as long and run just as strong as anyone with OEM oil.
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Old 05-03-2010, 11:11 PM   #40
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TWS is Group4/5; in it's own league

Quote:
Originally Posted by m3bergen View Post
Here's an interesting thread on TWS 10w-60 on the BITOG (Bob Is The Oil Guy) forum: http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums...56#Post1353856. All of the comments support the idea that TWS is a very, very good oil, particularly in its application in the m3 (more or less tailor-made by BMW/Castrol for the S54), and has a very advanced anti-wear package. Some of the posts from an Aussie who works in the lubrication industry (Exxon/Mobil, I think ) seemed to imply that TWS is a descendant of Castrol R and may contain some castor oil in its formulation. A separate post, also on BITOG, showed data from a German BMW forum comparing film strength of various oils. The TWS film strength, measured in kg/cm (whatever that is), was three to four times that of similar 15w-50 and 10w-60 oils, and almost as good as Motul 300V 15w-60, an ester-based racing oil.
I had correspondence with Doug. He is truly an expert. Check out what he sent to me, in excerpts. ( by the way I posted on that forum a while back, having seen the light on TWS. ... by the way I was a hardcore M1 fan prior! )

START

Hi,
I first used Castrol's R 15w-50 (castor based) great smell - in 1978

In 1980 I commenced a Senior Technical position with a major International Company whereby I could try new technologies and the like

We (Castrol & I), first decided to test the product in late 1980 a wide range of engines;

Diesel
4cyl IL Isuzu, Kubota, Benz
3cyl IL Kubota

Petrol
6cyl IL Nissan
4cyl IL Mitsubishi
2cyl Horizontal (air coooled)

Castrol reformulated the "R" to a non castor lubricant early in the test programme

The tests involved stationary and mobile engines in ambient temps ranging from -6C to 50C
Regular UOAs were done to monitor the lubricant's condition and some engine tear downs were undetaken. The tests lasted until 1985 and covered hundres of thousand of hours of use

A number of minor formulation tweaks took place which I was a part of of course

Later (in 1986) an employee of mine (an Automotive Engineer) from IH - Mercedes Benz was employed with my help by Castrol as a Lubricant Engineer. This rekindled the testing regime again in 1989 but this time it was with HDEOs. He remains with Castrol today as a Senior Lubricant Engineer and we are still excellent friends of course

I continued to use Castrol R 10w-60 (from 1980) until 1999 in a variety of engine families and random UOAs were carried out

The lubricant 10w-60 is very durable and during the tests in the early 1980s were were able to get up to 4000hrs service before OC. We averaged about 2500hrs. We averaged 80km/h (50 mph) here in this test regime
Regards
Doug Hillary

PART 2
I cannot provide more data than you probably already have

But this might help you

1 - ALPINA worked on its formulation with Castrol/BMW
2 - It suits DI engines due to its viscosity namely HTHS @ 5.4cP
3 - It has an excellent Pour Point (-42C) which is much better than some lighter viscosity lubricants
4 - It was progressively developed from 1997 as a low chlorine/minimised phosphorous lubricant

Its part ester/part PAO base has been constructed over a period of 30 years on an excellent development path

In its early life is was used by Sauber-Mercedes winning at LeMans and in Formula 1 engines (Ford-Cosworth). It was used at one point by Porsche in some race engines. It was also used here in the V8Supercars ZF six speed gearboxes with great success

It is a bit like a heavy weight version of M1 0W-40 or Delvac 1 5W-40 in its formulation
END
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