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Old 03-30-2015, 02:53 PM   #81
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Originally Posted by Act of God View Post
There's nothing there that says there was a subpoena and THEN the emails were deleted. This is a key difference, and a huge difference at that.
You're correct, the Wikipedia timeline is a bit vague on those details and those details certainly are pertinent. I'm trying to find a more detailed timeline of the Bush email controversy while the (legal) specifics regarding the Clinton controversy are still in flux.

If she did indeed delete emails AFTER a specific legal subpoena was issued, then yes, she's in potentially deep legal doodoo. However, she undoubtedly has a lot of high-paid legal counsel (or she darn well better get some ASAP), so I suspect if she did, it was through some obtuse legal loophole. That might allow her to dodge legal jeopardy, but it will certainly take a substantial and deserved toll on her reputation and POTUS aspirations.

Last edited by Rhumb; 03-30-2015 at 05:17 PM.
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Old 03-30-2015, 04:04 PM   #82
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Not sure how my statement, "I'm certainly not defending Clinton's use of a private email server/account to conduct America's official business," is somehow "dishonest." I would fully agree that the issue you describe above is a part of her many, many problems with using a private email server and possibly, legally the biggest and most serious one.
Your dishonesty is plain for all to see, especially with statements like this:

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However, I also think the GOP Congresses delving into this is about 95% political expediency and 5% legitimate legal concern.
You "think?" No, actually, you don't "think." You "react" with complete partisan blindness. It is almost like your responses are involuntary, a reflex. Try using your brain sometime, instead of just your spinal chord.

You have no idea how or why the GOP is investigating this, other than what you wish for, so your attempt to "weigh" the GOP's motives as 95%/5% is absurd. Did they take a vote, and were those the vote tallies for each of two options? Who voted? How are you able to ascribe one or two motives to a group of hundreds who in fact may all have unique motives? No need to respond.

Alas, just like criticism of Obama must be rooted in racism rather than bad ideas, in your simple biased world the investigation of Hilary must be "political expediency." We've got Carnac the Magnificent among us in PT!
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Old 03-30-2015, 05:15 PM   #83
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Your dishonesty is plain for all to see, especially with statements like this:
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Originally Posted by Rhumb
However, I also think the GOP Congresses delving into this is about 95% political expediency and 5% legitimate legal concern.
Well yes, I am being quite honest with my opinion even if you don't necessarily agree with it. While, again, I'm not defending her use of a personal email account/server for doing official business (I've been taking her to task for it on a number of levels), neither am I defending the GOP's overall record and impartiality in investigating this administration and its members. These two ideas can honestly coexist in a "pox on both their houses" kind of way. Given the Congressional GOP's so far fruitless six+ year history of constant hounding of the Obama administration with any number of ____-Gate investigations all of which have turned up basically nothing of any real substance, some concerns about motive or at best competency is not unwarranted.

Perhaps this one will finally be different, but given the history of their "investigations" so far...

I'll leave the rest of your red-faced rant, below, to sputter on alone.

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You "think?" No, actually, you don't "think." You "react" with complete partisan blindness. It is almost like your responses are involuntary, a reflex. Try using your brain sometime, instead of just your spinal chord.
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You have no idea how or why the GOP is investigating this, other than what you wish for, so your attempt to "weigh" the GOP's motives as 95%/5% is absurd. Did they take a vote, and were those the vote tallies for each of two options? Who voted? How are you able to ascribe one or two motives to a group of hundreds who in fact may all have unique motives? No need to respond.
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Alas, just like criticism of Obama must be rooted in racism rather than bad ideas, in your simple biased world the investigation of Hilary must be "political expediency." We've got Carnac the Magnificent among us in PT!
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Old 03-30-2015, 08:27 PM   #84
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Ultimately, beyond her possible bid for another run at some political office. Does anybody think that if there is a whiff of "this was really illegal" let alone the slightest possibility of conviction, Obama won't grant her a Pres pardon, just as Ford did for Nixon. H.W. Bush did for Bob McFarlane an Caspar. Clinton did for Symington and Duetch. W did for Scooter Libby.

If the allegations are true, it action needs to be taken. However, the end game result will be the same.
Those pardons usually get handed out on the last day of an outgoing POTUS term. She can't be pardoned until the whole thing has run it's course. What she needs is for this to be cleared up before the serious meat-and-taters fundraising and campaigning starts for next year's election.

Even by crooked DC politician standards, the POTUS issuing an pardon to a political ally and former employee in the middle of a campaign would be egregiously partisan.

The Dems don't care whether she deleted a bunch of incriminating emails that lay bare the sins of the executive branch. They just want their current golden child to avoid being charbroiled and their future golden child to be perceived as squeaky clean come campaign time.

The Repubs don't care whether there was actually any wrongdoing on her part by deleting incriminating emails, or what those emails might have revealed. Even if they can't keelhaul her, they want to create a cloud of uncertainty and give Repub candidates something to crow about if they end up running against her.
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Old 03-30-2015, 08:55 PM   #85
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I'm not going to defend anything. I just don't give a fvck - just like republicans dgaf when 22 million emails disappeared form the BushCo servers.
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Old 03-30-2015, 09:29 PM   #86
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Those pardons usually get handed out on the last day of an outgoing POTUS term. She can't be pardoned until the whole thing has run it's course.

That is the case with all pardons except a presidential pardon. Refer to Ford's pardon of Nixon. A presidential pardon can be granted before a case is resolved.
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Old 03-31-2015, 10:34 AM   #87
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I believe this is lie #3?

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/n...mail/70708314/
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WASHINGTON (AP) - Hillary Rodham Clinton e-mailed her staff on an iPad as well as a BlackBerry while secretary of state, despite her explanation she exclusively used a personal e-mail address on a homebrew server so that she could carry a single device, according to documents obtained by The Associated Press.
There must have been some heavy stuff in those emails
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Old 03-31-2015, 10:56 AM   #88
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I'm not going to defend anything. I just don't give a fvck - just like republicans dgaf when 22 million emails disappeared form the BushCo servers.
Oddly enough, I'm with you on this one buddy. I may not like that Hillary very much but I'm not really concerned with what she has done here. She has done far worse things in her career.
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Old 03-31-2015, 10:57 AM   #89
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Oddly enough, I'm with you on this one buddy. I may not like that Hillary very much but I'm not really concerned with what she has done here. She has done far worse things in her career.
you didn't get the memo that you are supposed to be outraged? this directly caused benghazi.
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Old 03-31-2015, 11:00 AM   #90
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you didn't get the memo that you are supposed to be outraged? this directly caused benghazi.
I can be rational. Didn't you know?
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Old 03-31-2015, 11:31 AM   #91
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I can be rational. Didn't you know?
It's actually quite irrational to not give a crap about someone destroying evidence after they were hit with a subpoena.
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Old 03-31-2015, 11:32 AM   #92
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It's actually quite irrational to not give a crap about someone destroying evidence after they were hit with a subpoena.
are you assuming evidence was destroyed or do you know something we don't?
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Old 03-31-2015, 11:36 AM   #93
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It's actually quite irrational to not give a crap about someone destroying evidence after they were hit with a subpoena.
I understand why it's bad, I just don't know if its really worth getting all worked up over. I don't see her winning the election and what she has done in on par with all the other illegal stuff that happens everyday in Washington.

I should clarify that I'm not concerned with the content of the emails. Her actions regarding them is a different matter, but they still aren't too bad in perspective.
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Old 03-31-2015, 11:37 AM   #94
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I don't see her winning the election
who do you see winning?
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Old 03-31-2015, 11:41 AM   #95
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who do you see winning?
Far too early to tell, but its clear it won't be a Dem. The country gets bored of the Republican after two terms, votes in Democrat, then Rep, then Dem. It's all just a bunch of "well maybe this new guy from the other party won't be so bad". In this case, the Republicans are now on the side of the lesser of two evils. Rand Paul is doing surprisingly well, but I don't know who the front runner will be once the race heats up. None are rising to the top just yet. And in case you were wondering, I do like Rand Paul, but he's not my first choice.
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Old 03-31-2015, 11:42 AM   #96
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are you assuming evidence was destroyed or do you know something we don't?
According to her lawyers, per the article I posted, she wiped it.
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Old 03-31-2015, 11:44 AM   #97
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Far too early to tell, but its clear it won't be a Dem.
have you not been paying attention in the news? republicans are tripping over themselves trying to do their best to not get elected


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According to her lawyers, per the article I posted, she wiped it.
she wiped wedding and yoga emails, what evidence?

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Old 03-31-2015, 11:47 AM   #98
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have you not been paying attention in the news? republicans are tripping over themselves trying to do their best to not get elected

What are you talking about? Teddy is trying. Rand is making an announcement in April.
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Old 03-31-2015, 11:48 AM   #99
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she wiped wedding and yoga emails, what evidence?
Her lawyer making a statement is official. He said, according to the article, that she WIPED it clean.

You are defending the indefensible.
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Old 03-31-2015, 11:48 AM   #100
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Her lawyer making a statement is official. He said, according to the article, that she WIPED it clean.

You are defending the indefensible.
how is there evidence of wrongdoing if there is no evidence?
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