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DIY: Do It Yourself
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Old 09-17-2016, 09:58 PM   #81
sannouni
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It could be that the wire itself is faulty or shorted somewhere... Did you try to run a wire from the ECU to The Fan ( pwm wire)
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Old 06-12-2017, 10:22 AM   #82
Codje
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Not convinced by my INPA test results... fan going dead?

Hi everyone,

I've got through a recent overheating issue on my 323i (manual EUR produced in october 98, with the single electric fan).
First, I figured out that my fan was not turning due to a bad coolant sensor (a brand new Febi Bilstein... no luck...).

With another new sensor, the fan turns on when coolant gets too hot but I think my fan is going dead since I'm not sure it turns full speed when too hot (just small noise like a computer fan...).

I have the 1st gen Bosch module described by BMW-North in his excellent notice (thanks for sharing by the way!).
My module is a bit "bloated" so I think it's going dead.
I'm quite convinced that the fan turns too slow because in 1 hour traffic jam, with 25C outside, no AC, the coolant temp starts to rise to 103C 104C (my Tstat opens at 97C) and cannot get lower until I put heater on full hot, even if I drive around 15mph. (I didn't take the risk to let it rise higher with no heater).

To test the module, I've been through INPA test for testing speeds from 30% to 89%.
I can tell you that each speed request received an answer.
And I noticed speed changes depending on the request (speed is getting higher with the request).
However at 90%, I think I'm far away for from full speed (I saw in this forum that full speed fan should produce a lot of noise and air flow, like it is ready to take off). Unfortunately I cannot compare with a friend.

What do you think? Is my fan too slow even if it answers all DME speed requests ? Is it a clear sign that the bloated module cannot handle correctly the requests and should be changed ?
Thanks a lot
Another detail : I cannot see my fan turning on at startup

Last edited by Codje; 06-12-2017 at 10:28 AM.
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Old 06-12-2017, 05:09 PM   #83
cirrusblau
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It should definitely be quite loud at full speed.

try these:





My car wasn't able to take 25 C traffic for that long, even with the heat at full. Maybe that's because I've got the bigger engine? I know it can handle 20 C with a light breeze and heat on full in heavy stop and go traffic.
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Old 06-14-2017, 04:20 AM   #84
Codje
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Thank you for your inputs, my fan is definitely too quiet.
I'll replace it with a used one, I'm a bit afraid of aftermarket ones and cannot afford a genuine fan right now.
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Old 06-20-2017, 09:39 AM   #85
ElCornDog
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Adding my experience

I just wanted to drop a quick note adding my experience to this thread after finding it very useful in troubleshooting my problem.

My fan was working but only very slow. During the winter, without AC and with the heater on, the radiator had no problem keeping up with the engine even with the fan not working. As soon as it got hot and I ran the AC, stop and go traffic would cause the temp gauge to creep into the red. Running the heater would bring it back down to normal.


I hooked my scanner up and ran the electric fan test. It would engage but only at very slow speed. I also noticed that the silicone potting material in the fan speed control box had "expanded" and was squirting a bit out of the cover-- something had gotten hot inside that box.

Replacing the fan fixed the overheating problem and greatly increased the efficiency of my AC when idling.

Something I searched for and didn't find on the forum was how the electric fan test should work. When initiated, it should blow at top speed-- anything less than that and you can assume the fan needs to be replaced. It should also be noted that the car was throwing no error codes. Apparently the fan can work only at slow speeds and not register an error so keep an eye on that temp gauge!
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Old 06-30-2017, 01:19 AM   #86
Codje
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Hi, just wanted to let a final word and thanks for the details ElCornDog, it was the same issue finally.
I replaced the fan and now everything looks fine. The fan blows as a real fan.
I'll do a INPA test in the next days but the first driving test is promising.

Indeed, first test throws no error codes even with too low speeds...
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Old 07-29-2017, 04:17 PM   #87
Evnmopwr
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thread revival.

my 2001 e46 325I MT was knockdd infront. electric fan between engine and radiator. new thermostat, new pipes, expansion tank, waterpump, belts etxstc. after the repair, I went for test drive. the original fan I had in, bosch, I fitted to a new shroud and it was fine. when it kicked on at max temperature, it made this loud mechanical metal on metal noise. once it disengaged, it never came on again.

I replaced the fan with an original bosch. started the car. fan spun slowly for about 20seconds. instead of switching off, it started spinning faster and now stays on at full blast while the car is on and driving.
tested the fan on my cousins 325ti and it works there.

read for codes,
* 7D - activation electric fan
* 0B - sensor, coolent temp, radiatir outlet

ran fan test from delphi and it activated the fan fine so that tells me comms to the fan is fine

replced the coolent temp sensor, and ots coroded plug and 0B error is now gone but the fan still spins up full blast.

7D error still there.bled the cooling system, and 7D error still there

today I bought new fan, aftermarket. tested on my cousins 325ti, works beautifully.
installed on my car, spins up at full blast constantly.

must not, the 3pin plug to final stage resister was shot, so I clipped the wires midway the old one off and soldered a new one in place.

issue remains... checked 50a fuse and it was fine. replaced anyway but issue remains

WTF is the problem? DmE is bustd?? whats the failure rate of that??

habe not tested for continuity yet. must the faults be cleard before it works? will historical faults cause this to happen?

why does it seem the dme does its check when the car starts and gets the fan spinning slowly for 20seconds but the fan is not responding to th dme with its data?

I have no clue what to do next. please advise

Last edited by Evnmopwr; 07-29-2017 at 04:20 PM.
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Old 07-31-2017, 02:45 AM   #88
Evnmopwr
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update... I fixed my constantly spinning fan last night

turns out it was the ac pressure sensor. the plug was damaged in the accident and was not correctly plugged in

I had a sensor from a parts car I have,replaced the sensor and the plug andit now works 100% ok

not sure why I over looked the pressure sensor error on the diagnostics but im a happy chappy again
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Old 08-22-2017, 04:18 PM   #89
Earendil
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Once upon a time I saw a list of car models (maybe even part numbers) that used the same fan control module as the one used on modern OEM E46 fan assemblies. I can not for the life of me find it. Anyone have that link or knowledge?

Background for the question:
My fan finally died, and with my trusty voltmeter and jumper wires I've narrowed the problem down to the fan module. I have a million parts stores around me but none that carry the correct (expensive) fan assembly for my 328i. However, I feel confident that they probably have a fan assembly for a different car with the right fan module.
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Old 10-08-2017, 02:32 PM   #90
djglover
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Good thread - lots of material - need advice

Here's what I own:
2004 325xi E46, M54, manual trans, puller/electrical fan

Just did a bunch of component replacements, tanks, hoses, belts, etc. I suspect the fan was failing when I started this work due to overheating issues (BUT, I attributed it all to the tank and sensor components!).

- New hoses
- New tank
- New temp sensor (lower radiator hose)
- Thermostat and housing is fairly new

Here is the current status:
- No fan error codes
- No fan activity with AC turned on
- No fan activity when coolant temp rises
- 12v to connector (upstream from final controller on fan assembly)
- Fan will run when final controller is bypassed (12v applied directly to motor).

Time for a new fan assembly?

Dennis
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Old 10-08-2017, 03:20 PM   #91
ti317
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Quote:
Originally Posted by djglover View Post
Here's what I own:

2004 325xi E46, M54, manual trans, puller/electrical fan



Just did a bunch of component replacements, tanks, hoses, belts, etc. I suspect the fan was failing when I started this work due to overheating issues (BUT, I attributed it all to the tank and sensor components!).



- New hoses

- New tank

- New temp sensor (lower radiator hose)

- Thermostat and housing is fairly new



Here is the current status:

- No fan error codes

- No fan activity with AC turned on

- No fan activity when coolant temp rises

- 12v to connector (upstream from final controller on fan assembly)

- Fan will run when final controller is bypassed (12v applied directly to motor).



Time for a new fan assembly?



Dennis


The only way to know is to us INPA and activate the fan Test. Search here and you will find posts on how to do it.


Sent from a FEMA reeducation camp, somewhere in Flor-ri-duh!
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Old 06-30-2018, 05:36 PM   #92
armwt
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About to pull what's left of my hair out.

2000 E46 Touring.

Got 12v to the fan, and it *appears* to have a signal on the PWM wire, but I don't have an oscilloscope to test. No errors, just no spinning on the fan.

So I replaced the fan. No change. Exact same behavior. So I got myself an INPA cable, got the software installed, and ran the fan diagnostics... no change. Zero response from the fan. Bypass the controller and apply 12v to the motor, fan spins (new and old)

So right now I have two possibilities that I know of, but don't know what I'm missing:
a) Both new and old fans have bad final stage controllers.
If true, I should be able to return the fan, roll the dice, and theoretically get another fan and be fine.
b) ECM is bad.
If true, I'm more or less screwed, I'll need to replace ECM, get it cleared, keyed, etc.

Any option "C" that I'm missing?

Last edited by armwt; 06-30-2018 at 05:37 PM.
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Old 07-01-2018, 07:54 AM   #93
ti317
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Quote:
Originally Posted by armwt View Post
About to pull what's left of my hair out.



2000 E46 Touring.



Got 12v to the fan, and it *appears* to have a signal on the PWM wire, but I don't have an oscilloscope to test. No errors, just no spinning on the fan.



So I replaced the fan. No change. Exact same behavior. So I got myself an INPA cable, got the software installed, and ran the fan diagnostics... no change. Zero response from the fan. Bypass the controller and apply 12v to the motor, fan spins (new and old)



So right now I have two possibilities that I know of, but don't know what I'm missing:

a) Both new and old fans have bad final stage controllers.

If true, I should be able to return the fan, roll the dice, and theoretically get another fan and be fine.

b) ECM is bad.

If true, I'm more or less screwed, I'll need to replace ECM, get it cleared, keyed, etc.



Any option "C" that I'm missing?


Did you replace the fan with a new one or used? I would try to get a connector from a junkyard that would allow me to apply 12v power to the fan to see if it spins.
Or take the fan to another car and use INPA to activate it. Once I had a fan I knew worked, I would troubleshoot back from there.

Also, try and get the wiring diagram.
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Old 07-01-2018, 08:45 AM   #94
armwt
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Both fans (new and old) spin with 12V (ran straight from battery terminals).

New fan was new. Cheap (Amazon) not Bosch or anything, but not a single negative review.
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Old 07-01-2018, 09:27 AM   #95
sannouni
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Quote:
Originally Posted by armwt View Post
Both fans (new and old) spin with 12V (ran straight from battery terminals).

New fan was new. Cheap (Amazon) not Bosch or anything, but not a single negative review.

Here's part of my reply from a few posts up. In short, as outlined below. Check the vehicle wiring harness that runs to the fan. More than likely, the 12V and the ground are working. But the third wire (thin wire) might be the problem.


Pin #4 on the circuit diagram for the electric fan (look up "electric fan E46 Circuit Diagram", on the web, you will find it), unplugged the connector at the fan, and the other end at the ECM, checked continuity of that wire, only to find a 1K Ohm resistance on that line, which, after discussing with an electrical engineer friend, found it to be suspiciously too high) i spliced the wire from the engine control module (ECM) to the electric fan connector, it worked, i've been driving the car now for few days with no issues, and the fan does come on much more than it used to before... also, note this: i had tested my old fan (i didnt throw it out), and it turned out that there was nothing wrong with the original BMW electric fan, it fired right up...

I really hope that this can help someone in the future...
by the way: the AC used to cut off when i'm at a stop in traffic, i thought i had a problem with my AC, but it turned out that once i fixed the fan issue, the AC problem disappeared
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Old 07-08-2018, 05:46 PM   #96
armwt
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Thanks @sannouni. Looks like you nailed it - started unwrapping the loom, and sure enough, just a couple of inches in and the wire was broken. Tracking it back now to try to determine WHERE it is still good - the signal wire feels brittle everywhere I've unwrapped it, and I'm showing high resistance everywhere I've peeled it back so far. Still trying to find the ECM connector - most photos when I google are for the E36 instead of the E46, but running a new wire looks like my best bet right now.
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Old 07-08-2019, 02:24 PM   #97
bodrin
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>BTW, from what I have read, pwm wire should read about .4v. Also gauge on dash and display mode 7.0 come from coolant temp sensor on back/driverside of engine. ECU uses sensor at lower radiator hose to control fan, again that's what I have read.
...
>Right, temperature on the dash is definitely engine block which is isolated from the radiator until the thermostat opens.

Hi, my AC goes off when the car is stationary. The fan runs but the speed seems too slow .. almost no sound from it. And even strange it sometimes goes off at 108 degrees C (dash gauge mode 7.0). Also the gauge on dash and display mode 7.0 fluctuates between 108-110 degrees C and I can see some people suggest that for this engine (M43) it should be like 102-105 degrees C.

I had some tablet connected to my e46 318i 1998 1.9 (some android app .. not sure about it) and it was showing like 93 degrees Celsius on the engine temp sensor and 80 degrees C at the lower radiator hose temp sensor. Do you think that this temperature difference is possible?
I think I probably would try to replace the radiator temp sensor.
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