FBI's credibility problem: Peter Strzok - Page 3 - E46Fanatics E46 BMW Social Directory E46 FAQ 3-Series Discussion Forums BMW Photo Gallery BMW 3-Series Technical Information E46 Fanatics - The Ultimate BMW Resource BMW Vendors General E46 Forum The Tire Rack's Tire Wheel Forum Forced Induction Forum The Off-Topic The E46 BMW Showroom For Sale, For Trade or Wanting to Buy

Go Back   E46Fanatics > Everything Else > The Off-Topic > Political Talk

Political Talk
You may discuss anything regarding politics in this forum ONLY. If you cannot respect others opinions, your access to this forum will be removed.

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 12-07-2017, 07:29 PM   #41
Cabrio330
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Dallas
Posts: 154
My Ride: 2013 F30 335i
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rhumb View Post
Excellent piece, somewhat similar to the one I posted earlier.

The hyperbolic right wing hue and cry that Strzoc's personal texts making fun of a political candidate has itself tainted his own work and further, that of the independent council's is risible. Of course Justice, FBI and most other public service members have political views. That is there right and responsibility as U.S. citizens.

What are AOG, Cabrio et al suggesting? That there should be some preliminary political screening process for investigators and prosecutors? How would that work? Should only Dems investigate Dems and GOP'ers investigate GOP'ers to avoid "witch hunts?"

Or should it be the other way around to avoid political favoritism? Those reflexively impugning Strzoc seem to want only GOP'ers investigating anyone, implying that Dems are somehow inherently unfair and GOP'ers not.

Has Trump, as POTUS and thus our country's head of the federal Justice system abjured himself of any whiff of political leanings, bias or partisanship? Even the briefest scan of his words and Tweets would clearly show, hell no, and if anything, quite the opposite.

The FBI and Justice Department are hardly dens infested with "Deep State" Dems looking to impose our freedoms, install a New World Order, or whatever other nebulous conspiracy the right wing is talking themselves into.
Dhumb, suppose you are on trial for pedophilia and your public defender discovers that half of your jury has been talking at a local watering hole with other patrons about how they despise socialistic partisan hacks just like this guy named Dhumb who is a defendant in a case they are now hearing. Upon learning this, your public defender complains to the judge and makes a motion for a mistrial. The judge laughs at your public defender and tells him he is grasping at straws. What do you do?
__________________
Quote:
At the core of liberalism is the spoiled child miserable, as all spoiled children are, unsatisfied, demanding, ill-disciplined, despotic and useless. Liberalism is a philosophy of sniveling brats.--PJ O'Rourke
Cabrio330 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-07-2017, 07:32 PM   #42
Cabrio330
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Dallas
Posts: 154
My Ride: 2013 F30 335i
Quote:
Originally Posted by VaderDave View Post
Food for thought: would Strzok have made it onto a Jury hearing a case against Trump?
What an excellent hypothetical!
__________________
Quote:
At the core of liberalism is the spoiled child miserable, as all spoiled children are, unsatisfied, demanding, ill-disciplined, despotic and useless. Liberalism is a philosophy of sniveling brats.--PJ O'Rourke
Cabrio330 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-07-2017, 07:35 PM   #43
swordsman11868
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Las Vegas
Posts: 1,665
My Ride: 2003 325i
FBI's credibility problem: Peter Strzok

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cabrio330 View Post
What an excellent hypothetical!


Neither would have Mark Furman against OJ.
__________________
I'm just here to change the world.
BMW Wiki: http://www.bimmerfest.com/wiki/index.php

2016 Beheadings in Saudi Arabia: 92.

Last edited by swordsman11868; 12-07-2017 at 07:35 PM.
swordsman11868 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-07-2017, 08:43 PM   #44
Cabrio330
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Dallas
Posts: 154
My Ride: 2013 F30 335i
Quote:
Originally Posted by swordsman11868 View Post
Neither would have Mark Furman against OJ.
Yep, and Furman's conduct factor heavily into OJ's acquittal.
__________________
Quote:
At the core of liberalism is the spoiled child miserable, as all spoiled children are, unsatisfied, demanding, ill-disciplined, despotic and useless. Liberalism is a philosophy of sniveling brats.--PJ O'Rourke
Cabrio330 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-07-2017, 08:50 PM   #45
Rhumb
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Virginia
Posts: 142
My Ride: 2001 M3 Coupe
Quote:
Originally Posted by VaderDave View Post
Food for thought: would Strzok have made it onto a Jury hearing a case against Trump?
Interesting thought. Not sure the parallelism is 100% though, but I think your article touched on that, if a bit obliquely.
Rhumb is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-07-2017, 09:08 PM   #46
Cabrio330
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Dallas
Posts: 154
My Ride: 2013 F30 335i
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rhumb View Post
Interesting thought. Not sure the parallelism is 100% though, but I think your article touched on that, if a bit obliquely.
Nice tap out.
__________________
Quote:
At the core of liberalism is the spoiled child miserable, as all spoiled children are, unsatisfied, demanding, ill-disciplined, despotic and useless. Liberalism is a philosophy of sniveling brats.--PJ O'Rourke
Cabrio330 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-07-2017, 10:54 PM   #47
VaderDave
Invictus
 
VaderDave's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: El Dorado Hills, CA
Posts: 12,055
My Ride: 330CiC ZHP
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rhumb View Post
Interesting thought. Not sure the parallelism is 100% though, but I think your article touched on that, if a bit obliquely.
It's definitely not exactly the same. But it does provide a little context for how we ought to be thinking about the special counsel. Is the special counsel's team supposed to be an investigative body, or a prosecutorial body? Prosecutors start from the position that a crime has been committed and seek actively to prove that point. I don't think that's what the special counsel is supposed to do, at least in theory.
VaderDave is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-08-2017, 07:16 AM   #48
Act of God
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: In your gf's front hole
Posts: 356
My Ride: Longboard
Send a message via ICQ to Act of God Send a message via AIM to Act of God Send a message via Yahoo to Act of God
Quote:
Originally Posted by VaderDave View Post
Food for thought: would Strzok have made it onto a Jury hearing a case against Trump?
Yes, because he would have lied during voir dire and said he harbors no biases.


Another one possibly outed? The Judge in Flynn's case just recused himself and did not give a reason. Turns out, he's also a FISA judge.



You know, that secret court that issued a wiretap based on a fake dossier?
__________________
Whataboutism is a moral necessity, because it disarms the hypocrisy the left wields like a battle axe by illustrating the undeniable truth.
Act of God is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 12-08-2017, 07:17 AM   #49
Act of God
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: In your gf's front hole
Posts: 356
My Ride: Longboard
Send a message via ICQ to Act of God Send a message via AIM to Act of God Send a message via Yahoo to Act of God
Tucker Carlson also reporting that the lawyer who represented Hillary's IT guy is Mueller's right hand man in this investigation (Aaron Zebley).
__________________
Whataboutism is a moral necessity, because it disarms the hypocrisy the left wields like a battle axe by illustrating the undeniable truth.
Act of God is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 12-08-2017, 12:53 PM   #50
Act of God
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: In your gf's front hole
Posts: 356
My Ride: Longboard
Send a message via ICQ to Act of God Send a message via AIM to Act of God Send a message via Yahoo to Act of God
OK this is getting crazy. One of Mueller's attorneys was at Clintons election night party.

http://dailycaller.com/2017/12/08/mu...n-night-party/
__________________
Whataboutism is a moral necessity, because it disarms the hypocrisy the left wields like a battle axe by illustrating the undeniable truth.
Act of God is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 12-08-2017, 04:56 PM   #51
Rhumb
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Virginia
Posts: 142
My Ride: 2001 M3 Coupe
Quote:
Originally Posted by Act of God View Post
OK this is getting crazy. One of Mueller's attorneys was at Clintons election night party.

http://dailycaller.com/2017/12/08/mu...n-night-party/
Good for him for doing so, you know exercising his Constitutional right and responsibility to engage in the political process.

I suspect other DOJ attorneys were at Trump's gala, as is their right too. I hope they had a good evening given their preferred candidate won.

I assume, come Wednesday AM, all returned to work to conduct their duties in a professional and unbiased manner, be they Dems or GOP'ers.
Rhumb is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-08-2017, 06:54 PM   #52
Black///M
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Jacksonville, Florida
Posts: 58
My Ride: 2004 M3 Coupe
Quote:
Originally Posted by Act of God View Post
OK this is getting crazy. One of Mueller's attorneys was at Clintons election night party.

http://dailycaller.com/2017/12/08/mu...n-night-party/
Now, that is a meltdown! His candidate lost and he found his way into the witch hunt.
Black///M is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-08-2017, 07:34 PM   #53
VaderDave
Invictus
 
VaderDave's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: El Dorado Hills, CA
Posts: 12,055
My Ride: 330CiC ZHP
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rhumb View Post
Good for him for doing so, you know exercising his Constitutional right and responsibility to engage in the political process.

I suspect other DOJ attorneys were at Trump's gala, as is their right too. I hope they had a good evening given their preferred candidate won.

I assume, come Wednesday AM, all returned to work to conduct their duties in a professional and unbiased manner, be they Dems or GOP'ers.
Yes. That's undoubtedly what happened.

How is it, though, that nobody on Team Trump appears to have managed to make it onto Mueller's special counsel team?
VaderDave is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-09-2017, 08:06 AM   #54
Act of God
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: In your gf's front hole
Posts: 356
My Ride: Longboard
Send a message via ICQ to Act of God Send a message via AIM to Act of God Send a message via Yahoo to Act of God
Quote:
Originally Posted by VaderDave View Post
Yes. That's undoubtedly what happened.

How is it, though, that nobody on Team Trump appears to have managed to make it onto Mueller's special counsel team?
How can an independently living adult be as stupid as him?
__________________
Whataboutism is a moral necessity, because it disarms the hypocrisy the left wields like a battle axe by illustrating the undeniable truth.
Act of God is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 12-09-2017, 09:33 AM   #55
VaderDave
Invictus
 
VaderDave's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: El Dorado Hills, CA
Posts: 12,055
My Ride: 330CiC ZHP
I can see how it might be easy, though, for a person living and working in DeepStateLand to develop the unconscious bias that the federal bureaucracy (and especially one's own party within that bureaucracy) is benevolent. It's not necessarily stupidity.

Last edited by VaderDave; 12-09-2017 at 09:33 AM.
VaderDave is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-09-2017, 09:38 AM   #56
Rhumb
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Virginia
Posts: 142
My Ride: 2001 M3 Coupe
Quote:
Originally Posted by VaderDave View Post
Yes. That's undoubtedly what happened.

How is it, though, that nobody on Team Trump appears to have managed to make it onto Mueller's special counsel team?
Are you saying there are no Republicans, that we know of, in the Mueller investigation?

What if there are, would that then somehow taint the investigation the way the right wing is implying having Democrats is somehow doing?

What sort of political litmus test would you be proposing for federal prosecutors and their staff? Should only registered Independents who've never voted be allowed.

Isn't Mueller himself a lifelong Republican, nominated as FBI Director by Republican GW Bush and overwhelmingly confirmed by the Senate?

That he's suddenly become some sort of Democratic stooge is strained to say the least, much less to invoke some sort of "Deep State" conspiratorialism.

Or, is the right wing simply trying to nullify this investigation that they don't like in the first place in order to protect their deeply unpopular President?

Last edited by Rhumb; 12-09-2017 at 10:09 AM.
Rhumb is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-09-2017, 09:44 AM   #57
VaderDave
Invictus
 
VaderDave's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: El Dorado Hills, CA
Posts: 12,055
My Ride: 330CiC ZHP
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rhumb View Post
Are you saying there are no Republicans, that we know of, in the Mueller investigation? Isn't Mueller himself a Republican?

What if there are, would that then somehow taint the investigation the way the right wing is implying having Democrats is somehow doing?

What sort of political litmus test would you be proposing for federal prosecutors and their staff? Should only registered Independents who've never voted be allowed.
I chuckle at your Manichean duality. There's plenty of middle ground. I think it would be good to start with people who don't show a history of disparaging the very person they have been charged with investigating. But maybe that's just me being a silly goose.
VaderDave is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-09-2017, 10:12 AM   #58
Rhumb
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Virginia
Posts: 142
My Ride: 2001 M3 Coupe
Quote:
Originally Posted by VaderDave View Post
I chuckle at your Manichean duality. There's plenty of middle ground. I think it would be good to start with people who don't show a history of disparaging the very person they have been charged with investigating. But maybe that's just me being a silly goose.
Which is precisely what Mueller did - immediately removed him from the investigation - upon learning of Strzok's text message. That would seem to speak highly of Mueller's integrity.
Rhumb is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-09-2017, 10:16 AM   #59
VaderDave
Invictus
 
VaderDave's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: El Dorado Hills, CA
Posts: 12,055
My Ride: 330CiC ZHP
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rhumb View Post
Which is precisely what Mueller did - immediately removed him from the investigation - upon learning of Strzok's text message. That would seem to speak highly of Mueller's integrity.
Immediately removing someone upon learning of bias is a little different than removing someone once it becomes apparent that the long-known bias will soon become public knowledge.

I guess we just have different definitions of "integrity," though. Not unexpected.
VaderDave is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-09-2017, 10:33 AM   #60
Rhumb
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Virginia
Posts: 142
My Ride: 2001 M3 Coupe
Quote:
Originally Posted by VaderDave View Post
Immediately removing someone upon learning of bias is a little different than removing someone once it becomes apparent that the long-known bias will soon become public knowledge.

I guess we just have different definitions of "integrity," though. Not unexpected.
My understanding is that Mueller's actions are best described by your first scenario, removing Strzok immediately upon learning of his private texts this past summer long before his texts became publically known just recently.

PS, as far as I know, there is still no actual bias by Strzok in the performance of his duties, just concern about the possible perception of bias. Should any investigator who may have privately texted positively of Trump also be removed for the appearance of bias?

Last edited by Rhumb; 12-09-2017 at 10:34 AM.
Rhumb is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Censor is ON



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 04:19 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
vBulletin Security provided by vBSecurity v2.2.2 (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2019 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
(c) 1999 - VerticalScope Inc. All rights reserved.