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Old 12-12-2017, 07:13 PM   #81
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Originally Posted by VaderDave View Post
Is there any wonder that government waste is at an all-time high, when there is a revolving-door/incestuous relationship between government bureaucracy and the various industries that have sprung up to service that bureaucracy? It's an echo chamber of graft and corruption and self-congratulation.
I might question your one assertion - that government waste is at an all time high. Is there any empirical data to support that contention or is that more anecdotal?

I would say you are somewhat wide of the mark as to the nexus of whatever waste or corruption might be occurring, that the far worse nexus is not that of the executive branch, civil service bureaucrats, who are quite constrained in their latitude to commit malarkey.

Far worse is the incestuous, revolving door relationships between industry lobbyists and the people sent to DC from outside of DC, the legislative branch Senators and Representatives and their staff. There's orders of magnitude greater latitude for them to sluice funding or slip in hugely favorable legislation to their patrons. That's the Big Game vs. bureaucratic Sidewalk Marbles level corruption.

Just look at the GOP's Plutocrat Tax Relief bill they just shotgunned through Congress. It certainly wasn't Joe Six Pack or Bob Bureaucrat who made mint on that.
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Old 12-12-2017, 07:19 PM   #82
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I might question your one assertion - that government waste is at an all time high. Is there any empirical data to support that contention or is that more anecdotal?
It's empirical.

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I would say you are somewhat wide of the mark as to the nexus of whatever waste or corruption might be occurring, that the far worse nexus is not that of the executive branch, civil service bureaucrats, who are quite constrained in their latitude to commit malarkey.
For many, the very existence of their jobs/departments/agencies is malarkey. So, in effect, they're committing malarkey 24/7.

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Far worse is the incestuous, revolving door relationships between industry lobbyists and the people sent to DC from outside of DC, the legislative branch Senators and Representatives and their staff. There's orders of magnitude greater latitude for them to sluice funding or slip in hugely favorable legislation to their patrons. That's the Big Game vs. bureaucratic Sidewalk Marbles level corruption.
It's also disgusting. But that doesn't excuse the needless waste of taxpayer funds on the bloated bureaucracy.

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Just look at the GOP's Plutocrat Tax Relief bill they just shotgunned through Congress. It certainly wasn't Joe Six Pack or Bob Bureaucrat who made mint on that.
I know a lot of poor people who don't pay taxes are outraged that their tax bill will double from zero to zero dollars. It makes me chuckle that allowing a wealthy person to keep more of his/her own money equates to "making mint" in some people's minds. The money doesn't belong to the government. It belongs to the people who made it. It's not a "taking" to keep more of what belongs to you.
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Old 12-12-2017, 07:30 PM   #83
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I agree this is a big problem. What's the solution?
Or rather, what and where exactly does the bulk of the problem lie? The rhetoric - be it the "Washington Swamp" or the conspiratorial "Deep State" rhetoric - is vague, loose and sloppy. Where's the actual deep end of the swamp vs. the wet puddle end?

Is the "waste and corruption" concern epitomized by Betty Bureaucrat who might be able to slide some contracts to some chum?

Or is the Deep Swamp at the legislative and political end, where millions and billions can be conferred upon their deep-pocketed donor class.

Yes, corruption, fraud, abuse, etc. certainly do exist at the federal levels (as well as state and local levels, likely in comparable levels), but perhaps best to make sure to train one's fire at the vultures rather than the mosquitoes.
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Old 12-12-2017, 07:36 PM   #84
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Or rather, what and where exactly does the bulk of the problem lie? The rhetoric - be it the "Washington Swamp" or the conspiratorial "Deep State" rhetoric - is vague, loose and sloppy. Where's the actual deep end of the swamp vs. the wet puddle end?

Is the "waste and corruption" concern epitomized by Betty Bureaucrat who might be able to slide some contracts to some chum?
Not necessarily. But if Betty works for an agency that doesn't need to exist and, in fact, is a drain/boat anchor on society, then that's incredibly wasteful and corrupt.

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Or is the Deep Swamp at the legislative and political end, where millions and billions can be conferred upon their deep-pocketed donor class.

Yes, corruption, fraud, abuse, etc. certainly do exist at the federal levels (as well as state and local levels, likely in comparable levels), but perhaps best to make sure to train one's fire at the vultures rather than the mosquitoes.
This isn't about individual corruption. It's about institutional corruption.
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Old 12-12-2017, 08:12 PM   #85
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More recusals involving Fusion GPS, how far does this go?

http://dailycaller.com/2017/12/12/fe...sion-gps-case/
Federal Judge Recuses Herself From A Second Fusion GPS Case
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Old 12-13-2017, 01:02 AM   #86
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Text messages obtained, bias all over

https://mobile.twitter.com/shannonbream
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Old 12-13-2017, 08:04 AM   #87
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Some of the good ones:



"Trump is a loathsome human"

"God, Hillary should win 100,000,000-0.''

"This man can not be president.''

"wow, Donald Trump is an enormous d*uche.''

"I do so hope his disorganization comes to bite him hard in November.''

"Trump should go f himself.''

On Election day: "OMG this is F*CKING TERRIFYING,''
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Old 12-13-2017, 08:17 AM   #88
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yup

"I want to believe the path you threw out for consideration in Andy's office - that there's no way [Trump] gets elected - but I'm afraid we can't take that risk," FBI counterintelligence official Peter Strzok wrote in a cryptic text message to Lisa Page, an FBI lawyer and his mistress.

"It's like an insurance policy in the unlikely event you die before you're 40," Strzok wrote in the text, dated Aug. 15, 2016.

"Maybe you're meant to stay where you are because you're meant to protect the country from that menace," Page wrote.

"I can protect our country at many levels, not sure if that helps," Strzok replied.

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Old 12-13-2017, 08:40 AM   #89
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If you need further proof they were all "with her"

"I just saw my first Bernie Sanders bumper sticker. Made me want to key the car," Page wrote in an August 2015 exchange.
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Old 12-13-2017, 07:12 PM   #90
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So, is it collusion when 2 FBI employees meet with the deputy director of the FBI, in his own fcking office, and concoct a plan to oust a president they don't like?

Asking for a friend...
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Old 12-14-2017, 08:01 AM   #91
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Love how the resident useful idiots won't touch this with a 10 foot pole now

https://www.wsj.com/articles/the-fbi...nce-1513210929
The FBI's Trump 'Insurance'
More troubling evidence of election meddling at the bureau
Quote:
Democrats and the media are accusing anyone who criticizes special counsel Robert Mueller as Trumpian conspirators trying to undermine his probe. But who needs critics when Mr. Mueller's team is doing so much to undermine its own credibility?

Wednesday's revelations-they're coming almost daily-include the Justice Department's release of 2016 text messages to and from Peter Strzok, the FBI counterintelligence agent whom Mr. Mueller demoted this summer. The texts, which he exchanged with senior FBI lawyer Lisa Page, contain expletive-laced tirades against Mr. Trump. Such Trump hatred is no surprise and not by itself disqualifying. More troubling are texts that suggest that some FBI officials may have gone beyond antipathy to anti-Trump plotting.

"I want to believe the path you threw out for consideration in Andy's office-that there's no way [Trump] gets elected-but I'm afraid we can't take that risk," Mr. Strzok wrote Ms. Page in an Aug. 15, 2016 text. He added: "It's like an insurance policy in the unlikely event you die before you're 40."

What "policy" would that be? The "Andy" in question is Andrew McCabe, the deputy FBI director. FBI officials are allowed to have political opinions, but what kind of action were they discussing that would amount to anti-Trump "insurance"?

In another exchange that month, Ms. Page forwarded a Trump-related article and wrote: "Maybe you're meant to stay where you are because you're meant to protect the country from that menace." He thanked her and assured: "Of course I'll try and approach it that way." Mr. Strzok, recall, is the man who changed the words "grossly negligent" to "extremely careless" in James Comey's July 2016 public exoneration of Hillary Clinton's emails.

The McCabe meeting came on the heels of the FBI's launch of its counterintelligence probe into Trump-Russia ties. July is also when former British spook Christopher Steele briefed the FBI on his Clinton-financed dossier of salacious allegations against Mr. Trump. The texts explain why Mr. Mueller would remove Mr. Strzok, though a straight shooter wouldn't typically resist turning those messages over to Congress for as long as Mr. Mueller did.

Meanwhile, we're learning more about the political motives of Mr. Mueller's lieutenant, Andrew Weissmann. Judicial Watch last week released an email in which Mr. Weissmann expressed his "awe" and praise for Sally Yates, after the then acting AG and Obama holdover refused to implement Mr. Trump's travel ban.

This should trouble anyone who cares about the integrity of the Justice Department. Ms. Yates had every right to resign at the time if she felt she couldn't implement Mr. Trump's order. But she had no authority as an executive branch official to defy a legitimate presidential order. Mr. Weissmann's support for her insubordination was a declaration that he is part of the "resistance." This should be unacceptable in a ranking FBI official, much less someone charged with conducting a fair-minded investigation.

Public confidence isn't helped by the continuing Justice and FBI refusal to cooperate with Congress. Deputy Attorney General Rod Rosenstein, who supervises Mr. Mueller, toed the Mueller-FBI line on Wednesday before the House Oversight Committee. He repeated FBI Director Christopher Wray's preposterous excuse that he can't answer questions because of an Inspector General probe. And he wouldn't elaborate on the news that Nellie Ohr, the wife of senior Justice official Bruce Ohr, worked for Fusion GPS, which hired Mr. Steele to gin up his dossier.

The man who should be most disturbed by all this is Mr. Mueller, who wants his evidence and conclusions to be credible with the public. Evidence is building instead that some officials at the FBI-who have worked for him-may have interfered in an American presidential election. Congress needs to insist on its rights as a co-equal branch of government to discover the truth.
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Old 12-14-2017, 08:12 AM   #92
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I forgot about the texts about using secret phones that can't be traced. Time to shut these agencies down.

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Old 12-14-2017, 01:32 PM   #93
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special phone they used "when we talk about hillary because it can't be traced"

Wtf
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Last edited by Act of God; 12-14-2017 at 01:32 PM.
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Old 12-14-2017, 04:11 PM   #94
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Everything electronic can be traced, they need the NSA's help for this.
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Old 12-14-2017, 04:40 PM   #95
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They literally concocted a plot to remove the president in McCabe's office. How is this not sedition?
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Old 12-19-2017, 09:21 AM   #96
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Bruce Ohr just decided not to show up for congressional hearings yesterday

https://twitter.com/joshdcaplan/stat...81299676745729

Think Andrew McCabe, who already canceled once after the texts came out, will show today?
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Old 12-28-2017, 09:33 AM   #97
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More bias uncovered

https://www.dailywire.com/news/25143...-prestigiacomo
Prosecutor Assisting Mueller Openly Brags About 'Legal Resistance' To Trump

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Old 12-28-2017, 11:04 AM   #98
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The more "crazy" things come out of this investigation, the more I believe it is an entrapment for obstruction of justice. They want Trump to stop the "objective" shenanigans, so he can obstruct since collusion is not a crime.
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Old 12-28-2017, 12:40 PM   #99
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Oh they're praying to allah every night that Trump shuts this thing down, it's their only hope.
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Old 01-08-2018, 07:39 PM   #100
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Yup, they found more. This time it's them texting about leaking info to the news and pretending their surprised by it.

http://thehill.com/homenews/house/36...ble-news-leaks
FBI agents' text messages spur congressional probe into possible news leaks
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Republican-led House and Senate committees are investigating whether leaders of the Russia counterintelligence investigation had contacts with the news media that resulted in improper leaks, prompted in part by text messages amongst senior FBI officials mentioning specific reporters, news organizations and articles.

In one exchange, FBI counterintelligence agent Peter Strzok and bureau lawyer Lisa Page engaged in a series of texts shortly before Election Day 2016 suggesting they knew in advance about an article in The Wall Street Journal and would need to feign stumbling onto the story so it could be shared with colleagues.

"Article is out, but hidden behind paywall so can't read it," Page texted Strzok on Oct. 24, 2016.

"Wsj? Boy that was fast," Strzok texted back, using the initials of the famed financial newspaper. "Should I 'find' it and tell the team?"

The text messages, which were reviewed by The Hill, show the two FBI agents discussed how they might make it appear they innocently discovered the article, such as through Google News alerts.

"I can get it like I do every other article that hits any Google News alerts, seriously," Strzok wrote, adding he didn't want his team hearing about the article "from someone else."
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