P1351 - 5th cylinder misfire - replace ignition coil with brand new or used is fine? - E46Fanatics E46 BMW Social Directory E46 FAQ 3-Series Discussion Forums BMW Photo Gallery BMW 3-Series Technical Information E46 Fanatics - The Ultimate BMW Resource BMW Vendors General E46 Forum The Tire Rack's Tire Wheel Forum Forced Induction Forum The Off-Topic The E46 BMW Showroom For Sale, For Trade or Wanting to Buy

Go Back   E46Fanatics > E46 BMW > General E46 Forum

General E46 Forum
This is the place to get answers, opinions and everything you need related to your E46 (sedan, coupe, convertible and wagon) BMW!

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Rating: Thread Rating: 17 votes, 5.00 average. Display Modes
Old 03-02-2011, 01:52 AM   #1
taskeen21
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Los Angeles, California
Posts: 188
My Ride: 2002 325i
P1351 - 5th cylinder misfire - replace ignition coil with brand new or used is fine?

hi All,

car is throwing error code P1351 - 5th cylinder misfire. i searched and found that ignition coil is the most probable culprit. ready to replace it.
just 3 important questions:
1. is it OK to replace it with used coil or should i ONLY replace it with BRAND NEW one?
2. Should I replace ALL 6 or just the replace the BAD one?
3. Should I buy the whole ignition coil set (coil + spark plug socket) OR just buy coil and reuse the old spark plug sockets?

thanks in advance.
__________________
taskeen21 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-02-2011, 02:07 AM   #2
Eliott's-BMW
Registered User
 
Eliott's-BMW's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: TX-DFW
Posts: 1,099
My Ride: E46 3-Pedal Mafia
First swap coil 5 to say with coil 1, reset the car computer and check the codes again, if it was a coil problem then you should now have an error in coil 1, if you get the same code then all your coils are OK and the problem is something else..
__________________
Who has the skills?
e30 project

"May GOD grant you DOUBLE the amount you wish upon me!"
Eliott's-BMW is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-02-2011, 02:12 AM   #3
uzi577
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: TO
Posts: 69
My Ride: e46,323
Quote:
Originally Posted by taskeen21 View Post
hi All,

car is throwing error code P1351 - 5th cylinder misfire. i searched and found that ignition coil is the most probable culprit. ready to replace it.
just 3 important questions:
1. is it OK to replace it with used coil or should i ONLY replace it with BRAND NEW one?
2. Should I replace ALL 6 or just the replace the BAD one?
3. Should I buy the whole ignition coil set (coil + spark plug socket) OR just buy coil and reuse the old spark plug sockets?

thanks in advance.
the idea to have a reliable and well running engine

1) replacing with used one not recommended- you just dont know when it is going to crap out.

2) recommended because the engine is using them pretty much evenly, that means if one goes, others not too far behind!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

3) your call, if you on top of your tuneups and/or replaced them recently them I dont see a point. But if you never done it since purchase them I would recommend invest couple $.
Good luck!!!!!!!!!
__________________
You WILL NOT rise for the occation, You WILL sink to the level of you training.
uzi577 is offline   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Old 03-02-2011, 01:29 PM   #4
taskeen21
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Los Angeles, California
Posts: 188
My Ride: 2002 325i
thanks a lot

awesome! thanks a million for your inputs. I really appreciate it. Will take the suggestions seriously. And update the thread too. Thanks again.
__________________
taskeen21 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-02-2011, 03:16 PM   #5
2003 325i
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: New Hamburg, Ontario, Canada
Posts: 1,642
My Ride: '03 Orient Blue 325i
I would do whatever's in your budget FOR THE ONE COIL only.
If you have verified this is your issue, then replace that coil, no need to spend more $ on things that aren't broken... fix them when that happens (flame suit on but I know I'm right). No problem on putting in a used coil as long as it's the same brand and model and in good working condition, just not likely to last as long as a new one... that's your option.

But heck, what does a 3rd year apprentice know...
2003 325i is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-02-2011, 03:35 PM   #6
taskeen21
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Los Angeles, California
Posts: 188
My Ride: 2002 325i
you hit the bulls eye! "budget" is The word man. I have spent close to $2000 on repairs (brakes, bearings) and now this . I am almost at a point of getting rid of the car. I literally created a FS thread too.
but, yea, i think i am going to first use a peake tool to get the exact code, swap the coil to make sure thatz the reason, then replace it with new one - for now.
tht looks like an economical and sensible solution right now. thanks again everyone. cheers!

Quote:
Originally Posted by 2003 325i View Post
I would do whatever's in your budget FOR THE ONE COIL only.
If you have verified this is your issue, then replace that coil, no need to spend more $ on things that aren't broken... fix them when that happens (flame suit on but I know I'm right). No problem on putting in a used coil as long as it's the same brand and model and in good working condition, just not likely to last as long as a new one... that's your option.

But heck, what does a 3rd year apprentice know...
__________________
taskeen21 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-02-2011, 04:32 PM   #7
2003 325i
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: New Hamburg, Ontario, Canada
Posts: 1,642
My Ride: '03 Orient Blue 325i
P.S. I would still 'recommend' a new one as that is the better repair, but for safety's sake have no problems installing a working used coil
2003 325i is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-02-2011, 05:20 PM   #8
josephmech
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Tucson AZ
Posts: 298
My Ride: 2001 325i sedan 5m
spark plugs?
josephmech is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-02-2011, 05:44 PM   #9
taskeen21
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Los Angeles, California
Posts: 188
My Ride: 2002 325i
Quote:
Originally Posted by josephmech View Post
spark plugs?
i replaced them less than 5,000 miles back. Bosch i guess.
__________________
taskeen21 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-02-2011, 08:09 PM   #10
beef1020
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: maryland
Posts: 387
My Ride: 00 323i
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eliott's-BMW View Post
First swap coil 5 to say with coil 1, reset the car computer and check the codes again, if it was a coil problem then you should now have an error in coil 1, if you get the same code then all your coils are OK and the problem is something else..
+1, diagnosis the problem before you throw parts at it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by uzi577 View Post
the idea to have a reliable and well running engine

1) replacing with used one not recommended- you just dont know when it is going to crap out.

2) recommended because the engine is using them pretty much evenly, that means if one goes, others not too far behind!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

3) your call, if you on top of your tuneups and/or replaced them recently them I dont see a point. But if you never done it since purchase them I would recommend invest couple $.
Good luck!!!!!!!!!
As a general rule I don't replace parts that are not broken. These coils and such are not maintenance parts, there is no need to replace them unless something is wrong with it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by taskeen21 View Post
i replaced them less than 5,000 miles back. Bosch i guess.
Did you get the plugs from the dealer? If you did not, and they are Bosch these very well could be the problem. While Bosch is OE on these cars, the aftermarket Bosch plugs that crossreference are not the same as the dealer Bosch plugs, and people have reported problems with them.
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by GoingNuts View Post
I don't need evidence, I just know.
beef1020 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-03-2011, 01:26 AM   #11
taskeen21
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Los Angeles, California
Posts: 188
My Ride: 2002 325i
Quote:
Originally Posted by beef1020 View Post
Did you get the plugs from the dealer? If you did not, and they are Bosch these very well could be the problem. While Bosch is OE on these cars, the aftermarket Bosch plugs that crossreference are not the same as the dealer Bosch plugs, and people have reported problems with them.
oops! you caught me there.
i bought the plugs from PepBoys. I went to the parts guy. he asked the make, model, year of the car. showed me the screen and said "these are the recommended spark plugs for your car". i bought them and installed them. so, i guess, now, i will have to add spark plugs to my diagnosis steps too? and how do i do that? first do the coil swap. if the error follows the coil then it is obvious. if not just change all spark plugs with factory OEM ones? please correct me if i am wrong. thanks a lot
__________________
taskeen21 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-03-2011, 02:14 AM   #12
N95
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: BHR
Posts: 66
My Ride: 330i
Your code above is generic for any car with OBD-II
Could be anything from bad gas to bad coil packs, to a crack in your intake elbow or MAF

but P1351 is all you have..no other codes?

If the connector boots were not replaced, this could your problem OR possibility of oil leakage or a faulty coil.

Pull all of the coils and boots and see if there appears to be oil in any of the spark plug tubes. If there is, you need to do a VCG. If #5 has oil, then there's your source of the miss-fire. If there is no oil in #5, swap the coil and boot, see if it repeats. Clear the codes, and see if the fault still comes up on #5 or if it moves to the new location. You can swap the boot and re-test or just replace all of the boots because they were likely not replaced when the spark plugs were done. If the fault still remains at the location of the suspect coil..THEN it's the coil.

The cylinder to the front of car is #1 and the one in the back by the firewall is #6

Change spark plugs to NGK BKR6EQUP

Do u have the old or new design coil?
__________________

Last edited by N95; 03-03-2011 at 02:16 AM.
N95 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-03-2011, 04:04 AM   #13
dmax
Registered User
 
dmax's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: NJ
Posts: 24,816
My Ride: '99 328i 360K miles
Year: 99
Model: 328i
Transmission: 5-spd
Quote:
Originally Posted by taskeen21 View Post
hi All,

car is throwing error code P1351 - 5th cylinder misfire. i searched and found that ignition coil is the most probable culprit. ready to replace it.
just 3 important questions:
1. is it OK to replace it with used coil or should i ONLY replace it with BRAND NEW one?
2. Should I replace ALL 6 or just the replace the BAD one?
3. Should I buy the whole ignition coil set (coil + spark plug socket) OR just buy coil and reuse the old spark plug sockets?

thanks in advance.
OP,

I like many of the suggestions. My mech replaces coil boots with plugs, since they're just wires that take a lot in their lifetime and go bad. One gorilla mechanic bending it might have pushed it over the edge!

Anyway, don't forget the fuel side...an injector could be bad or clogged.

Do you have a cel light on or just find the code while searching for them?

You ever use Techron or bmw's fuel system treatment (which is 'made with Techron technology and which everyone just assumes 'is' Techron)? Every few months my car will tell me subtly that it wants a little tonic, and I give it to her.

Finally, if you are doing this just coz you picked up the code one time, you should reset, drive, and retest. I presume you've done this and code is consistently returning.

I don't think using the wrong plug...what did you use...Pep boys might have given you the right plugs (bosch or ngk is what everyone uses, with a preference for ngk...don't know if that's just a fanatic's myth or not?)...but the odds of having a bad brand new plug is small...possible, but small. Look elsewhere...and search on plugs and what you used to see if you'll be swapping them all out again.

Nxx seems like he's got good ideas for you on the spark side...if he's N89's younger brother, then you should trust him!
__________________
See Facebook for upcoming shows...and listen to my podcast! dmax on Facebook

Unlisted vid just for you.


Mangofy your E46!

Last edited by dmax; 03-03-2011 at 04:06 AM.
dmax is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-04-2011, 12:42 AM   #14
taskeen21
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Los Angeles, California
Posts: 188
My Ride: 2002 325i
Thanks

wow! thatz a lot of technical knowledge there. I think as most of you have suggested my 1st step will be to get hold of a member who has a peake code reader and get the exact codes. then take it from there. GRIDLOCK has offered to read the codes for me. but, too bad. he is in huntington beach. 60 mile drive 1-way.
is anyone out here from west LA/culver city/torrance/santa monica/redondo beach/hawthorne areas? i even have a thread to borrow a peake code reader - https://forum.e46fanatics.com/showthread.php?p=12872446
how much is this reader anyways?
__________________
taskeen21 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-04-2011, 12:57 AM   #15
taskeen21
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Los Angeles, California
Posts: 188
My Ride: 2002 325i
Quote:
Originally Posted by taskeen21 View Post
how much is this reader anyways?
never mind, it's $100+
__________________
taskeen21 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-04-2011, 08:49 AM   #16
beef1020
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: maryland
Posts: 387
My Ride: 00 323i
You get 1 NGK plug and replace it for the #5 plug and see what happens.

Dmax, the aftermarket bosch plugs being crap is not a myth. They have a completely different design then the dealer bosch plugs, and have been known to cause problems this soon. My money is on your plug.
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by GoingNuts View Post
I don't need evidence, I just know.
beef1020 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-04-2011, 04:35 PM   #17
taskeen21
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Los Angeles, California
Posts: 188
My Ride: 2002 325i
Quote:
Originally Posted by beef1020 View Post
You get 1 NGK plug and replace it for the #5 plug and see what happens.

Dmax, the aftermarket bosch plugs being crap is not a myth. They have a completely different design then the dealer bosch plugs, and have been known to cause problems this soon. My money is on your plug.
Thanks buddy. will read the codes and post an update. then take it from there.
__________________
taskeen21 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-04-2011, 05:05 PM   #18
Stickbuilder
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Nashville TN/Central FL.
Posts: 1,406
My Ride: Touring, and others
One more time I'm gonna post pics of a bad coil. You will see the ash gray discoloration on the bowl of the coil. This is where the coil has been arcing.

Now here is the thing. Cylinder #5 is kind of the catch all cylinder. I have seen #5 throw a misfire code, simply due to a small vacuum leak, like the small signal hose to the Secondary Air Valve is broken.

I would suspect the Bosch spark plugs. The correct NGK plugs are the BKR6EQUP. If you do find a bad coil, you should replace them all. Do not use aftermarket coils. As promised, here are the pictures of the burned up coil.
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	IMG_4477.jpg
Views:	1818
Size:	74.3 KB
ID:	395326   Click image for larger version

Name:	IMG_4478.jpg
Views:	2244
Size:	71.7 KB
ID:	395327   Click image for larger version

Name:	IMG_4479.jpg
Views:	1778
Size:	75.6 KB
ID:	395328  
__________________
[/SIGPIC]I'm fluent in 3 languages:

English
Sarcasm
Profanity
Stickbuilder is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-04-2011, 07:53 PM   #19
beef1020
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: maryland
Posts: 387
My Ride: 00 323i
stickbuilder, are those the ones that had the recall?
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by GoingNuts View Post
I don't need evidence, I just know.
beef1020 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-05-2011, 02:17 AM   #20
Stickbuilder
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Nashville TN/Central FL.
Posts: 1,406
My Ride: Touring, and others
Quote:
Originally Posted by beef1020 View Post
stickbuilder, are those the ones that had the recall?
The ones with the recall were replaced during the recall. This is one of those that were replaced. Car has about 65K on the clock, and the coils were replaced somewhere around 17-18K. This coil (pictured) just threw the P0305 code a couple of weeks ago.
__________________
[/SIGPIC]I'm fluent in 3 languages:

English
Sarcasm
Profanity
Stickbuilder is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Censor is ON



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 01:54 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
vBulletin Security provided by vBSecurity v2.2.2 (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2019 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
(c) 1999 - VerticalScope Inc. All rights reserved.